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How is it lying to show screenshots that easily disprove your assertion that your comments were downvoted for weeks straight?

Second time being blocked doubt it will be the last something drives you to keep digging a bigger hole for yourself.

Then let your own words speak instead of crying that they get used to show your true nature. If you want people to believe you despite all the times you argue in bad faith and outright lie (like kneo24 just exposed you as lying) you wont rely on poor deflection attempts.

People who take the time to read your own words see that you are a pedo, I dont have to do anything but show them what you say. Anyone who reads our discussion knows that you can't defend your position without exposing yourself as either dishonest or morally abhorrent.

Putts fixin' Voat's bugs

Its your own statements why are you afraid of people seeing them? How is it dishonest to you to have people look at what YOU posted?

You support Dortex in his spamming of TOO but people exposing you for being a pedo and being able to conveniently remind them words that came from your own mouth as well as how many of your "brigade buddies" got banned is wrong?

You can push the narrative that your side "did nothing wrong" but only one side has the accounts banned for malicious activity and one being investigated for abusing the systems for spam.

There is only one solution to the problem of manipulation. Only you see the votes on your comments, and you only see your votes on other people's comments.

The idea that what people are allowed to see is set by a random bunch of idiots, crazy people, children, and cheaters is ludicrous.

Yes, people will have to be their own censors. This is how you go from being a snowflake to a fully self actualized adult.

"I wont keep engaging with those that win in arguments using logical and moral examples, so I am going to run away while feigning having maintained a position of superiority."

I already did, you just shifted the goal posts. You do realize looking at your comment history is easy and it easily disproves your assertion, right? Even with your shifted goal posts, it's easy to find that you're full of shit, as usual. Remember, your claim is that he's been doing it for weeks, so.... comments made 8 days ago fit in that time span.

Go ahead and rub those greedy hands together to figure out how to shift the goal posts again.

Sane is gone but his demonic ghost reeees on

I'm tempted to downvote, but I don't wanna get banned

"Vote manipulation" is the new "Russian bot". See somebody you don't like? Just flag em as vote manipulators. They let you know this is bullshit? Just label them a destroyer.

Who is The Angel? It's Q. Or Soros, or Hillary, or Trumpstein. You really expect some mysterious benefactor with a mystical name is on your side? Pffffttt.

Funny how all these Putt controversies come directly after a time when Voat was placed under alot of scrutiny

You could have stopped this.

So here is my understanding of the problem. Putt is apparently a reddit veteran and knows all about vote manipulation on reddit. Some of us do not have reddit accounts and have no clue about the customs and courtesies of reddit.

Vote manipulation was defined at reddit. Apparently Putt assumes that everyone understands reddit's rules. When we join here, there is no mention of obeying reddit's rules, and there is no definition of what the rules are. However, when the algorithm flags us, we are accused of breaking rules that were never explained or written down.

Putt runs this site, and whoever runs the site has to set some kind of rules. Banning folks who break clearly posted rules is entirely reasonable IMHO. Banning folks for failing to obey rules that were never explained is not reasonable IMHO.

I was benned six gorillion times. It was anudda shoah!! Shaloms™✡️

Axes for the vote manipulators! GOOD JOB!

If It Aint Broke, Don't Fix It

For LOLs you could put anyone bannable into a special sub-verse called the "Chum Bucket".

Let them duke it out in there, or scream into their own void. No posting or voting privs anywhere else. Or just strip voting privs and just let them post only on v/ChumBucket.

Why not, right?

Listen the vote system does not work. Maybe just make it a qualification requirement to post and then scrap it.

Seems like a waste of time for nothing.

Me and lots of people are wondering about @Laurentius_the_pyro in particular. Could you make sure that's not an error? Or perhaps clarify what kind of manipulation he did? The one thing that you could probably agree with from that post by Theo is that bans could be more clear. The only thing the log says is Target: 70times7, Type: -1 It would be nice if there was an expandable history log that would show really what happened. It could be 100% automated in the future.

I was talking specifically about subverse bans. None of the subs are big enough to need anything more than modmail for appeals.

fuck you and fuck voating off to 8ch

Who the fuck cares about votes? Could probably delete them and the majority wouldn't care.

You are a faggot

I have no dog in this fight just seems like the vote manipulation stuff needs to be looked at. Seen a lot of people complaining how they were unfairly banned because their votes didn't stick and when they tried to vote again they got banned. Either that or let's be more clear on what constitutes vote manipulation. Mr pim pretty much sums of the rest for me.

People need to know what Grace means.

We have a thing with voat being down because the voat code is really bad. Just like why you can't handle vote histories.

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My only issue with any of this (and this is likely parroted in the thread here) is that I will sometimes downvoat every comment a poster makes in a thread, especially if they're being a jackass. What I won't do is go to their page, pull each of their comments on unrelated threads and downvoat all of those, too.

I would be comfortable with my activity logs around this being published.

I've been reading this thread. I think the better though it would give more work for the MODs would be "you wouldn't get so much whining" would be to run the same thing but instead of banning it would print a list. Then the MOD's would use the list and go over the users and see if the list was correct, correct then ban, incorrect then take them off the list. Sure it's old fashioned but there are less headaches later on. The regular users are content and the problem ones are gone. Unless that list was like couple thousand people then maybe take the list and use it to refine the program. So each list is smaller. Heck if you did this enough times no one would get banned for false data. Tweaking easier than rewriting.

Relevant: http://www.poorlydrawnlines.com/comic/mad/

@PuttItOut I would still appreciate you getting back to me about my ban.

Most anyone who's looked at @WhiteMatter's comment history don't see anything that looks like it's been "manipulated," so I have no idea what is going on there.

randomly selected people, get sent a notification to vote on issue. Random is key. If it isn't random, it can be gamed.

As long as the shills are less than half of people, they jury will be valid.

PuttItOut is a Mossad planted Jew.

Shit Reddit Says aka Soapboxbanhammer is the entity trying to ruin voat and internet free speech.

@PuttItOut check out Poal they're celebrating.

Just make their account only able to message mods? I can assure you the thing is false detecting.

@PuttItOut

In 4chan-ish speak (or whatever)

It's called greentext, newfag. Just kidding, you're the oldest fag here. Love ya, Putt.

Got examples?

I think this is the right approach. To be clear, I know there are other cancers that will pop up, like spam posts, but we can live with those cancers. Imposing bans and censoring users seems counter to the culture and idealisms here on voat.

I can't allow manipulation, in any way

lmao.... look at you fucking liar, you banned the on person that was protecting against it

Someone told me Voat loves stickies.

@kevdude love stickies, you are kevnigger

https://youtu.be/z0A76wI2y14

My cat tells me how to vote. Is this the vote manipulation Putt is talking about ?

Really, no one has ever explained what an upvote get a Goat.

Really, if anyone wants votes all they have to do is go to v/niggers and say "I hate niggers!"

One look at your comment history shows that is quite simply untrue.

It could be that you get into arguments with a lot of different people and they use the downvote button on you, or people who see the drama you engage in and find your arguments lacking merit. If your stuff was truly being -1 bombed, every comment you've made would have at least -1 to it.

Even on page 2 of your comment history, finding items with no downvotes on it is easy.

It is incredibly easy to find the outright lies in your statements. You don't even make it hard.

Now, instead of rubbing your hands together like a greedy merchant and going "oy vey I'm being attacked!" without telling us why, have a little self reflection and make an honest post on the matter.

when then ban goes down, allow the banned account access only to an appeal page. If the appeal is denied then send final message and lock access to the appeal page so that avenue of communication can not be abused.

I always imagined there are these IDF guys who are running 10-20 accounts a piece. They just cut and paste replies and they don't really engage. They just put you down and downvote you. Just because they don't like your political view. Even on YouTube where I used to get banned 15 years ago oh, I ramped up my rhetoric and started providing documentation and resources for what I was saying. I would info bomb the thread with these links so if I got banned at least people got information. I also changed my way of talkin on YouTube and became incredibly rude and vulgar to assholes and cut them down by the knees. Now almost no one agrees with the Jews on YouTube. Almost all the comments are against them. Nobody is getting banned but what YouTube is doing now is removing all the videos I used as evidence for example on 9/11. All I am using is news footage video.

Vote manipulation is inevitable, you’ll never totally eliminate it. It’s not even well defined, and if it was it would still be difficult to enforce properly.

If your goal is stopping vote manipulation you should limit the impact of bans to be on the users ability to vote.

This is the second time you rushed thru something and kinda torqued it a little too hard. Now that usually results in a write up from your first line supervisor. But maybe we can file this one with just a "verbal" warning because you've been so highly productive lately ;-)

Really respect your willingness to try, thank you. He's not easy.

Have you never heard the phrase "measure twice, cut once"?

@HomerSimpson

Unben me you fuckin nigger

All I see are a bunch of screeching shills getting butt blasted that they're caught vote manipulating. The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

You guys have better ideas anyways, so how should we do this? What should the process be?

Again, whatever the process is, it shouldn't be automated. We're human beings. Yes, even the wehraboo geeks I come here to rip on, They count too. You want to ban users for, well, whatever criteria You can come up with? Fine, but being a script kiddy and making an automated process do it is fucking gay. Sit You ass down at Your computer, appoint some additional mods/admins/jannys/goat herders, and have actual humans research each case. Have a human being actually read a report, look into the accused user's history, check IP addresses, Etc, then make a call.

Honestly, the way You handled the QRVfags is a good example; A load of complaints came in about a certain sub, You investigated, saw some possible faggotry, and then You did the best first step: You contacted that user and talked to them politely. "Sup bro. Getting a bunch of complaints about X, here's My thoughts on that, what do You think/Can You fuck off with that shit before I smack Your ass?

This is how it's done.

Automate this shit, and You're going to hear screeching like nothing before. Have humans do it, and You'll get some screeching, just a lot less.

Also: Knock it off with the gay fucking cryptic, holier than thou poem posting, You sound like a fairy boy. You see Your post here? That's good. Just fucking say what's on Your mind, I can respect that.

I want to whine about something herd but clearly the cancer has metastasized. Watching this past few days unfold it is clear That VOAT has a cancer and that cancer revolves around a fucking comic character named Q

VOAT is cool and unique but has a qancer

I offer my services as an investigator. I've always stuck my nose into dark corners of voat.

Sounds like somebody could weaponize the ban process to get people banned who they dont like.

Not sure how the computer code shit works, but maybe a strike system.

1)"FIRST STRIKE" Punishment: Automatic Ban, Appeal Process: Given automatically upon request/ with generic warning inboxed (reduce's admin cost of somebody manually reading appeal shit)

2)"SECOND STIKE" Punishment: Automatic Ban, Appeal Process: Given automatically upon request 3-5 day ban. (just incase some guy some how got fucked by the system once, he is only fucked for 3-5 days. This may also encourage a user to reach out for help to get his shit unfucked, gives admin time to figure out how this goat got fucked and where the system needs improvment at the admins convenience)

3)"THIRD STRIKE" COMPLETE BAN Appeal Process: Must message admin to get unbanned (somebody has to read this shit) But if the system works right 99.99% of these bans would be legit.

Been there

My votes disappear. Could 'no tracking' be why? Banned if vote again?

"MANIPULATION!" Will be Voat's "RAPE!"

@kevdude has access to putts account, puttitout did not write this.

@kevdude has access to putts account, puttitout did not write this...

Putt just hurry up and purge the servers and let voat users start from scratch again. Add an min account activity value, say no ctivity in 30 days the account gets blacklisted. Still no activity after another 30 days the account gets deleted.

Avoid power users and all that crap by just rando wiping the server from time to time. No announcement, just do god's job and flood the planet and purge the filth.

@PuttItOut has made it clear for YEARS that he can see our votes.

Literally what I said in this whole thread.

I don't care if he is looking at votes for an administrative purpose.

I don't care that he has the ability to do so. He has admitted by himself, that the reason he looked at those posts was out of curiosity.

That's when I care.

Imagine, when you doctor comes to you and tells you that he's been looking at the photos he took of your hemorrhoids.

Doctor: "Mr. KevDude, I've been looking at the photos of your hemorrhoids..."

Kevdude: "Well doctor, tell me the news, is there something wrong with them?"

Doctor: "No...no...I just wanted to look at them out of curiosity"

@kevdude has access to putts account, puttitout did not write this...

Gasoline, match, and a picture of your middle finger, putt.

It's the only way to be sure!

Member those commies that kept clapping for twenty minutes after a speech for fear that the first one to stop would be executed? Apropos of nothing really.

this post was made by @kevdude, he has access to puttitout account

when was the last time putt made 3 GLOBAL stickies

https://voat.co/v/ProtectVoat/about/log/comment

https://voat.co/v/RidersoftheReich/about/log/submission

@kevdude is a power mod who deletes comments & submissions, claims its something he has never done under the wrong.

@kevdude uses /v/protectvoat to downvoat users and brigade subverses. he continuously lies about me because he is paid to do it.

and fucking lies 95% of the time, you can see he as in almost bot like attack c&p the same message to me over and over

He even ask for quote in his words "my services" to brigade a verse. he works along side of @crensch who is also a paid shill.

-dial

pppppprooof

http://archive.is/DHtc7

http://archive.is/aBFee

http://archive.fo/xzYWA

http://archive.fo/4vWqN

http://archive.fo/cRewl

and generally happens within seconds of my postings.... will PIA protect me from that puttitout, fucking sellout

kevdud bots

and he never has a real argument, I guarantee is a paid shill, much like crensch at this point

and dial was never a main... more lies you spineless cunt botter

[–] kevdude 0 points (+0|-0) 1.5 hours ago

If you get downvoted you get restricted.sdfgasdf

I created the account so that one day I could flush the other. But yeah, let's just go with your version, that I had evil intentions because you know, we have to rally behind Putt no matter how shit he pulls.

Are you Putt's Pet? Do you swaddle his balls for him? That's right, "you're a Builder!". YOU DO SO GOOD! Good kevdude, good.

Voat was a fluke. You're clearly a bad programmer, and you should feel bad.

_{jk ily}

Whether it was ONE person who saw it, or every human who has ever lived it is still a break of anonymity.

Maybe you're okay with having 1 person watch you take a shit as long as they don't record and post it, but I'm not, and many other people are not.

My apologies Dear Lord KevDude for having the sheer audacity to state that something bothers me. I shall retreat to my hovel and harvest your crops henceforth.

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Used to have a contentious relationship with him too. Talk to him. Try to reach a place where you agree to tolerate each other?

https://i.imgur.com/s4eamxv.jpg

Maybe they send each other messages about these.

488 ccp after almost 2 years on the site? I'm sure this is your only account. Mad because Putt banned some of your socks?

You have to use your unused account when Putt bans your real account because Putt made Voat Invite-Only to banned accounts can't come back.

But YOU KNOW THIS because we just talked about it which makes me wonder HOW MANY KEVDUDES ARE THERE.

I actually PMd @PuttItOut about your account. That Coors guy was begging for upvotes during the last migration. Certain things have been handled by the users for a very long time. Discouraging vote farming is one of them. I hope you get your account back dude.

kevdude 3 points (+4|-1) 23 hours ago

Now you've pissed me off. This is exactly what YOU GUYS DO. You rally and squash any decent at all cost. dismiss his concerns, he's nobody, he's a troll, he dissents against the plan

Obviously he has the power to do that.

But that doesn't mean that he should. Its his fucking site, if he wanted to he could just ban anyone who disagrees with him, but he's not a piece of shit so he doesn't do that.

I want to protest the banning

https://voat.co/v/ProtectVoat/3238502/18792834

of @fuark_auf by @argosciv, led by @theoldones. Banning for a perfectly legal and non-abusive post, no matter who made it or how much the poster or content is hated sets a horrible precedent. If we don't protect the most hated speech Voat will fall to trolls using divide and conquer tactics.

Weird. I got three all at once. 🤔🤔🤔

Oh he broke anonymity? Interesting? Can you link me to where he listed all the people who voted on that submission?

He saw the names. He doesn't have to post it for it to be a breaking of anonymity. The viewing of those votes were not directly relevant to any administrative investigation. Before you say that my 'comparisons are not relevant because this is Voat not X' this is an example of how privacy laws typically work.

Even someone's personal doctor, is not allowed to look at their patients records unless it is directly relevant to something that's going on.

When people vote in things such as elections be it state or local at least in the United States, the people who see the actual vote (e.g candidate X or candidate Y) are separate from the people that input the names into the list of people who voted to determine whether or not someone voted twice.

I suggest that when you ban users, their is an auto-generated post to v/banned (take it over- one post in 1.6 years) with their username in the post title. Users could appeal by being able to still post, in at least in that one thread, in v/banned, have that post with their banning show as link on their profile page.

Hopefully you're more entertained than stressed by all this, it is organic process.
Had a kid at McDonald's give me about $30,000 worth of psyche advice with my egg McMufffins last week, "Take it easy, man."

Thanks boss

The admin shouldn’t really be diving into what subverses do unless they are owned by the admin or their size makes them an integral part of the site.

Pls fix stickies

Yes. We need more clarity on what vote manipulation actually is. But probably should kill farms without mercy no matter. People get worked up about unimportant things sometimes. I’ve already seen much butthrt about the warning messages. How important really is your Voat account name? If I’m not mistaken, manipulators are still able to log in to their accounts, correct? Just not post or comment or PM. Maybe that’s not true. I assume in that case they also lose the ability to wipe their histories? To borrow a popular term, that seems problematic.

why did i get a vote manipulation warning?

Thanks @PuttItOut !

Nonetheless, you've made a difference!

Thank You Superman!

We wouldn't have this community without you.

(Ignore the shill's, most are just spoiled bratts!)

Perfection Is ~ "A Work In Progress"

Hold the line Patriot ;)

WRWY ~ WWG1WGA

If people are manipulating this place, they'll spam the appeals process until you're too tired to mess with it. Of this I'm convinced based on what I've seen from your friends

So again. He states:

So I looked up the downvotes on this submission out of curiosity.

As I mentioned, with the exception of administrative purposes, no ones anonymity should be broken for the sake of some curiosity.

Why is he looking at the names of people who downvoted that post? All of them could have been people who had been on the ban list, or none of them could. The bans are not even remotely relevant to my concern. Who votes on what, be it up or down, should be anonymous, to anyone and everyone unless it's something that is involved in breaking of site rules.

A clear definition of exactly you consider manipulation would be nice. For example if while reading a thread where user a and user b are arguing, is it manipulation to upvote user a's well written and logical comments while downvoting user b's "no u" type comments?

Lol.

OP details a labor of love.

My $.02 pasted from an earlier comment I made:

If:

You are using alt accounts to upvote each-other for any reason
You are in a team of people who all vote together on particular posts or posts by particular users, in the same direction
You are deliberately downvoting or upvoting every post a particular user makes regardless of location, quality, or content
You think you or someone else is being brigaded and you respond by using alt accounts to "correct the record"
You are using multiple alt accounts to vote on the same posts or comments for any reason
You are using multiple alt accounts to play SBBH games with vote totals
You are using multiple alt accounts to downvote pedos
You are using multiple alt accounts to downvote Jews
You are using multiple alt accounts to downvote and hide shills
You are using multiple alt accounts to upvote posts you think were downvoted unfairly, whatever reason or people who downvoted them

You ARE engaging in vote manipulation and you need to stop.

If people who manipulate votes also manipulate yours you could be flagged unfairly since there's not much of a way to distinguish between someone who is upvoted because of his 100 alts and someone who is innocent and happened to be upvoted by 100 alts

On Bans...

In 4chan-ish speak

Be Putt

Have a plan

Turn Voat to Invite-Only so no new accounts can be made

Post The Builder Part 1 and rally allies with shiny gifts, then mock the untermensch with their impending doom that they don't know about yet

Set the bans in motion

Go into the comments and declare how good you are and how bad they are while they are being banned behind the scenes

Get questioned about the validity of a couple of the bans.

No dissent is allowed. Putt has spoken.

Banned users are unpersoned, they can't bother me now.

:Holiday Weekend. I'll just take off because they'll cool down in a couple of days and this will be easier to "explain".

They already get a warning.

Ha, called it. Figured your algorithm thingy (old school sparky, never learned to code) was just set a little too strict. Anyway, most of the people you shitcanned deserved it. Thanks for clarifying. Hopefully folks can calm the hell down now.

hey I remember Unidan from reddit form like 8 years ago I left that place after ferguson riots live coverage suppression. THis job doesn't pay the Putt you are crazy but I am happy at that. ty for all you do

Youre a tranny

I hope you understand that the +/-1 reason given in the ban list is not enough and have many of us worry . Since you have the ability to track who votes for who why those votes are not public ? it may also help to find who downvotes all submissions in all/new every morning at 11AM CET .

The way administration works lacks transparency , i understand that you cannot release the script so you must find a way to expose the wrong doers beyond any reasonable doubt . You are asking us to trust you , well sure just remember where we all came from and how must our trust was appreciated in other mediums . As my people say : after be burnt by the soup enough times you will start blow air over yogurt .

Well, I'm still here so everything is groovy.

Friday stickies for v/guitar are great. Please keep that up. It's the best sub.

For the moment I think modmail is fine for subverse bans. If we get to reddit sizes we might need a more formal system.

Heck, afaik even reddit uses modmail for that.

Tie up the offenders. Throw them in the river. If they float they are a witch and should be banned If they sink then they are ok and ban lifted.

People were asking for a clear definition of what qualifies as vote manipulation because they didn't even know what they might have done that could have been interpreted that way. Imagine getting pulled over for driving 35 on a road without speed limit signs

I think some clarification about that would go a long way. It's unnerving thinking you were following the rules and then getting a ban or a warning that doesn't tell you what you were doing wrong.

Quit being a faggot and lift the posting limits on @antiracist

Sucks to be you.

No. Seriously. It has to really suck to keep clean diapers on 30,000 screaming toddlers.

Thanks for all your work! I’m pretty sure I couldn’t/wouldn’t do it.

You have been banned from Voat.

remove my ban from 2 months ago

Look, I am someone who is willing to assume the best out of people and that of course includes you @PuttItOut. When others believed you were immediately turning to the 'dark side' with each step I did not.

It wasn't the investor stuff that worried me.

It wasn't the builder/destroy stuff that worried me.

It wasn't the ban wave of people who were vote manipulating that worried me.

It was an edit.

Specifically, the edit on this post: https://voat.co/v/Voat/3239483

Even more specifically, it was this comment that you made.

So I looked up the downvotes on this submission out of curiosity. Most all are destroyers. Many of which will be banned shortly for previous vote manipulation. Interesting isn't it that those that abuse Voat also hate seeing this thread.

As far as I recall I voted that post up, but that edit just pisses me off. With the exception of looking at what was upvoted/downvoted and by who for the purpose of finding vote manipulators or other administrative reasons. You breached the anonymity that is voting. People should not be afraid to downvote something you or anyone else submits. Even if you had purely good intentions, even if it was just as a mild curiosity and nothing that you actually used, that was not something you should be doing.

People cheating at their fake internet pts is as good a reason as any to ban them. They can make a new account.

I can't allow manipulation, in any way. If the votes aren't true, I can't put my name on it.

And personally my problem is that I was accused of vote manipulation when in my opinion that just is not true. I do not use alts, I do not engage in organized brigades, I do not Voat from a users comment page. My voating is done as a single user in the forums and I don't use alt accts to increase my numbers. If I have a hard on for a particular user and I DV the shit out of them that isn't vote manipulation. If I DV every single thing Aged posts that isn't manipulation, I just hate pedos. I also UV almost everything from @Empress and a lot from TWs, am I manipulating that? If so, what are the thresholds for this activity?

The accusation of Voat manipulation is taken seriously here and people automatically jump to AltFarmer and I am not that. My activity logs are welcome to be published.

I just need some kind of idea what the fuck's going on. Preferably without the smug "ha, I already fixed it. If ur still banned its ur fault". A bunch of users in my circle were banned for doing less than I did, far as I can tell. Having been involved in Voat Drama, I also wonder why the opposing group isn't gone given vote manipulation is their stated goal.

Ahh fake Internet points, you have to wonder what's wrong in people's heads that they feel they have to collect them, while at the same time it tarnishes the content of the site where they're doing it.

Thanks for putting so much thought, time, and effort on making this place amazing dude. I appreciate you so much. :)

Hell yeah your stickies are awesome. Good morning, by the way. Good to see you up bright n early to get things sorted out. Good luck with the code and new process. That kind of stuff is above me. I just come here for the fire ass memes ;)

Love checking the site and seeing tons of stickies lol

I know what we need!

@PuttItOut gets 3 stickies, @heygeorge gets 2 stickies.