I'm going to try to avoid an in depth opener here but I am going to leave this stickied for us to discuss this. I've long been frustrated with the large number of people that reduce all civilizational and racial problems to Jewish plots. Some around here agree with me. Others just think I must be a Jew because I disagree with simplistic conspiracy theories.
Let's lay out some basics of what is legitimate and what is bullshit.
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Jewish media power - Jews are overrepresented in the US media yet still comprise a minority. And when people say Jews 'own' 'the media' this is the substance of it. They haven't the foggiest idea who owns the media in Germany or Switzerland.
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Jews control the world - bullshit with no real evidence.
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Rothschilds own most or all central banks - a kook theory derived from fringe sources.
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Jews ran the Soviet Union - overstated at best.
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Israel controls the United States - bullshit though the Zionist lobby has considerable power.
In my mind the most substantive criticism is that American Jews are mostly liberal and give Democrats upwards of 50% of their campaign funds in many cases.
What does this all amount to? Well, American Jews have a huge outmarriage rate. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 50%. Over the long run this will tend to dilute Jewish identity in the US and have them relate more to Gentiles. Some Jews will also start to self-deport as the alt-right gets stronger. Jews moving to Israel should generally be seen as desirable.
Notice I haven't said that pogroms are desirable though. But the gas oven set are apt to thinking my position is a 'Jewish' one. Few Jews would agree.
Cheesebooger ago
http://thezog.info/list-summaries/
pby1000 ago
Who are the shareholders of the Federal Reserve and the Bank of England?
The Rothschilds are not Jews...
foltaisaprovenshill ago
Same exact people, since at most 6 corporations control 99% of all media.
Just the Jewish control of the Federal Reserve, IMF and World Bank /s
A shit assertion with no facts to back it up - Rothschilds have long been known to be shareholders of the Federal Reserve, regardless of you pretending otherwise.
Marx and Bolsheviks are Jewish, both of them. Another baseless claim by you....
Israel did 9/11 and got away with it, if that's not enough proof they control the government I don't know what is.
Kattie ago
My turn now to jump into this thread.
My view is that the Jews probably did play a crucial role in the Bolshevik revolution. Even if they may not have outnumbered the Russians in sheer numbers I think they did it when it came to influence. I don't know if this piece written by Winston Churchill has already been cited but here it comes:
"There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews. It is certainly a very great one; it probably outweighs all others. With the notable exception of Lenin, the majority of the leading figures are Jews. Moreover, the principal inspiration and driving power comes from the Jewish leaders. Thus Tchitcherin, a pure Russian, is eclipsed by his nominal subordinate, Litvinoff, and the influence of Russians like Bukharin or Lunacharski cannot be compared with the power of Trotsky, or of Zinovieff, the Dictator of the Red Citadel (Petrograd), or of Krassin or Radek -- all Jews. In the Soviet institutions the predominance of Jews is even more astonishing. And the prominent, if not indeed the principal, part in the system of terrorism applied by the Extraordinary Commissions for Combatting Counter-Revolution [the Cheka] has been taken by Jews, and in some notable cases by Jewesses."
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v14/v14n1p-4_Weber.html
Joe_McCarthy ago
Well, Jews played an outsized role. Mostly during Red October where you had Trotsky and Joffe leading an armed revolt to seize key installations. But they were leading muscle composed heavily of non-Jews and then you had the Central Committee having like 6-8 Jews out of 26 and the first government having 1 Jew out of about 18.
The fundamental problem here is Jews were just severely lacking in numbers as a percentage of the population. Ipso facto that makes it hard to fathom how they could have essentially run the show. There were a lot of them though. And in key positions.
Joe_McCarthy ago
This thread is finally showing the correct number of replies.
Kattie ago
And an impressive amount of replies. This thread has turned into a real hit :)
QueenMab_II ago
Still beating this topic like a dead horse, huh?
BTW, we need some humor on this thread. Here's a Polish gas chamber: http://www.funofun.com/polish.htm
ColonialCandle ago
What do you think about Andrew Joyce and Kevin MacDonald? http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2017/11/02/agobard-of-lyon-and-the-origins-of-the-hostile-elite/
Joe_McCarthy ago
Not familiar enough with Joyce to give an informed opinion.
MacDonald can be useful but in practice seems to give Judeo-obsessives the impression that all racial and civilizational problems are reducible to Jews. I'm not sure it is even unfair to say that his opinions essentially amount to that.
ColonialCandle ago
Thank you
RM-Goetbbels ago
You have been an Israel dick sucking fucktard from day one but fuck!, you actually had to make a post declaring your undying love for Jewish cock?
Come on man, have a little self respect.
Joe_McCarthy ago
As noted in the OP and elsewhere on this thread my purpose with the opener was not to go in depth but to introduce a discussion. A thorough, in depth study of a truly reputable nature involving Jews and the American media has not been conducted as far as I know (and it certainly isn't covered by cherry-picked internet memes we see on platforms like Voat) but some effort has been made to get to the truth here and is a useful debunking of the more outlandish claims and memes:
https://jasonbayz.wordpress.com/2015/07/02/demographics-of-the-american-media-elite/comment-page-1/
There are sociological surveys related to ethnicity and occupation in the US though. Ethnic Germans make pianos. Italians fish if I remember correctly. Jews are overrepresented as media personnel and in banking. But the data I've seen shows it to be well under 50%. I recall one textbook showing Jews at about 37% of media personnel in one survey. That dovetails pretty closely with the findings of the link I posted above.
Eh, I'd think that's of a nature where the evidence would fall more on the people making the claim. 'Jews rule the world' seems pretty out there for those with an education that includes some understanding of how complex systems work. 'The world' is one of the most complex systems of all.
But as noted elsewhere on this thread Mark Weber, the Nazi leaning Holocaust revisionist, cited evidence from the 90s showing Jews made up 11% of American elites.
http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/jewishlobby.shtml
And that's the US, mind, where they are known to have a large population and significant power. Suggesting they have power surpassing this in Japan, China, India, etc., or even Europe is simply stupid. Very unlikely too is that Jews would have increased their proportion of global elites, or even American elites, since the 90s to the tune of controlling the world.
Jews ruling the world is a stupid conspiracy theory with no real evidence and with evidence even to refute it as I have just demonstrated.
It may come as a shock but most central banks are owned by the state as one would expect.
I've looked into specific lists of senior governing bodies here:
https://voat.co/v/OccidentalEnclave/2113109/10419306/10
The Central Committee of the Communist Party had about 6 Jews out of 26 members and the Council of People's Commissars (state as opposed to party and the first actual government) had one Jew (Trotsky) out of about 18, for example.
Social Security has been called the third rail of American politics because of the power of the AARP. They in some sense control policy in that key area because there are a lot of old people they have as members (far more than Jews in terms of numbers in the US). But to say they control the US would be quite doltish. The NRA has even finished ahead of the Zionist lobby in surveys of Washington insiders regarding the power of lobby groups in the US. Does the NRA control the United States?
http://www.timewarner.com/newsroom/press-releases/1999/11/15/fortune-releases-annual-survey-of-most-powerful-lobbying
Crensch ago
"I don't want the burden of proof, so I will shift it onto you."
Kek.
Joe_McCarthy ago
If that's what you got out of that response you're going to be even easier than I thought. With you I'm not going to hold back either.
Crensch ago
Oh, that's not all I got out of that, that's all that I care to respond to at the moment. It wasn't a response to my words, so I feel no real pressure to respond right away with a carpet-bombing of your stupidity.
Joe_McCarthy ago
From what I've seen from you you're fighting with a slingshot. After all, you just hit me with 'Ahaha. Not believing Jews rule the world makes ya dumm. Pr00ve j00z don't rule it!'
And that only after lifting part of my response where I annihilated the whole retarded idea.
Even dime store Jew haters aren't this stupid. You nutzis on 4chan, Voat, etc., occupy your own special ed class.
Crensch ago
From what I've seen, most here are pretty sure that your grasp on reality is tenuous at best.
Your claim is that they do not. Prove it.
If, by annihilated, you mean you showed how unequipped you are to argue your position, sure. I know you Jews like your word games.
It's hilarious that you would claim to know such a thing; more hilarious that you think anyone here would believe you.
Joe_McCarthy ago
I know a lot of things you don't when it comes to this topic. This is like a professor teaching a freshman. You'll find out though I'm in no particular hurry to take your head off. I usually have other things to do than spend several hours in one setting responding to a blizzard of bullshit. Your blizzard of bullshit will also be addressed last. You should feel honored.
Crensch ago
Apparently, you do not.
Another absurd claim you probably won't be able to support.
Because you know it'll be you smelling the bitter almonds.
Another claim I doubt is true.
I'm pretty sure it will be barely addressed, if at all. You'll push claim I have the burden of proof when you do, or claim that I have not met my burden of proof to your mind, which would be moving the goalposts out of reach of literally anyone arguing against you.
You'll also claim personal knowledge of things as a source like you did here, and expect others to just accept it.
Filthy Jews can't argue with anything more than fallacies and appeals to emotion.
ColonialCandle ago
Thanks for sharing this.
Is Israel our greatest ally?
Joe_McCarthy ago
Not in my opinion. Nor in the opinion of the American people:
https://voat.co/v/OccidentalEnclave/2161682
ColonialCandle ago
Thank you
ColonialCandle ago
http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/248430/nigel-farage-trumps-favorite-british-politician-goes-on-anti-semitic-riff-about-the-jewish-lobby
Joe_McCarthy ago
This has devolved into a flame war but not an entirely useless one:
https://voat.co/v/news/2219978
ColonialCandle ago
What do you think of The Greatest Story Never Told? https://voat.co/v/videos/2217763
Joe_McCarthy ago
Have not seen it. A pro-Hitler something or other I take it? Is it any good?
ColonialCandle ago
Yes, pro-Hitler. I didn't get too far in it: it's rather long.
ATX_1138 ago
Victor Ostrovsky.
Mossad Influence on U.S. Policy https://www.c-span.org/video/?66937-1/mossad-influence-us-policy
Victor Ostrovsky - "he's an Anti-Semite, because that's what we say he is." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t0WLOIAwKw
ATX_1138 ago
Jews are not a minority when it comes to upper levels, though. And they are organized. Did SNL have a vote about covering Weinstein or did a single Jew, Lorne, decide to not parody him.
Jews have a homeland and are forcing you to pay for it and fight their wars. No politician even DREAMS of SUGGESTING there be a White homeland and many openly work to eliminate White countries.
Churchill (a Jew boot licker) said something pretty strong about it.
http://www.fpp.co.uk/bookchapters/WSC/WSCwrote1920.html
There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution, by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews, it is certainly a very great one; it probably outweighs all others. With the notable exception of Lenin, the majority of the leading figures are Jews. Moreover, the principal inspiration and driving power comes from the Jewish leaders. Thus Tchitcherin, a pure Russian, is eclipsed by his nominal subordinate Litvinoff, and the influence of Russians like Bukharin or Lunacharski cannot be compared with the power of Trotsky, or of Zinovieff, the Dictator of the Red Citadel (Petrograd) or of Krassin or Radek -- all Jews. In the Soviet institutions the predominance of Jews is even more astonishing. And the prominent, if not indeed the principal, part in the system of terrorism applied by the Extraordinary Commissions for Combating Counter-Revolution has been taken by Jews, and in some notable cases by Jewesses. The same evil prominence was obtained by Jews in the brief period of terror during which Bela Kun ruled in Hungary. The same phenomenon has been presented in Germany (especially in Bavaria), so far as this madness has been allowed to prey upon the temporary prostration of the German people. Although in all these countries there are many non-Jews every whit as bad as the worst of the Jewish revolutionaries, the part played by the latter in proportion to their numbers in the population is astonishing.
They can attack a US naval ship and their PM can come and lecture Congress!
Joe_McCarthy ago
A study in the 90s found them to compose about 11% of American elites:
“Jews are only three percent of the nation’s population and comprise eleven percent of what this study defines as the nation’s elite. However, Jews constitute more than 25 percent of the elite journalists and publishers, more than 17 percent of the leaders of important voluntary and public interest organizations, and more than 15 percent of the top ranking civil servants.”
http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/jewishlobby.shtml
Of course the source cited, Prof. Benjamin Ginsberg, is a Jewish source, but he is being used here by Mark Weber, a leading Holocaust revisionist with pro-Nazi leanings, as a means to substantiate Jewish power. 11% is a minority and that Jews would have gone from that to a majority in 20 some years isn't plausible.
I disagree with the premise here. But even if true I hardly see how it substantiates that Jews control the world. As we just saw they compise 11% of American elites. That's America even - where they are known to be unusually powerful. What percentage of elites do they make up in Europe or China or Japan? The percentage is undoubtably much less. Do they control India? Brazil?
Jews ruling the world is bullshit.
Even Churchill seems to stop short of the Jewish Bolshevism claim. He just seems to draw attention to their heavy involvement in it. They were overrepresented. I go into specific numbers on this thread:
https://voat.co/v/OccidentalEnclave/2113109/10419306/10
The Central Committee of the Communist Party had 6 Jews out 26 more or less. Though one can bicker over a couple of the others. That's a minority.
The first Council of People's Commissars (state as opposed to party) had one Jew, Trotsky, out of eighteen.
The best argument for Jewish Bolshevism concerns the first politburo set up to overthrow the government. Three Jews out of seven. But as we have seen in senior ruling bodies they were a decisive minority.
And these were the early years. Jews made up less of the leadership in later years particularly after Stalin's purges. Litvinov was even removed as foreign minister under Nazi pressure.
That suggests possible influence or that the US didn't want issues over the matter for various reasons. There are alternative explanations for how we deal with Israel other than that we operate under Zionist control.
Israel would like us to recognize their occupation of the Palestinian. We don't. They regard Jerusalem as their capital. We refuse to recognize that. Why if they 'control' us?
AIPAC, the Zionist lobby in the US, has considerable lobbying strength - but in a narrow sphere revolving around foreign policy. They don't control US healthcare or energy policy. They don't even care about it really. But even here lobbies like the NRA or AARP (old folks lobby) have ranked ahead of AIPAC on lists of powerful lobby groups. Does the NRA control the US? And why would anyone assume 'control' is even reducible to lobbying? Power is diffuse and has many centers. One is the voters. Enough voters voted for Trump to put him in power. Most Jews didn't like that.
ATX_1138 ago
The only part mentioning 11 percent goes on to say....
“Jews are only three percent of the nation’s population and comprise eleven percent of what this study defines as the nation’s elite. However, Jews constitute more than 25 percent of the elite journalists and publishers, more than 17 percent of the leaders of important voluntary and public interest organizations, and more than 15 percent of the top ranking civil servants.”
From the same link: * Two well-known Jewish writers, Seymour Lipset and Earl Raab, pointed out in their book, Jews and the New American Scene: / 6 “During the last three decades Jews [in the United States] have made up 50 percent of the top two hundred intellectuals... 20 percent of professors at the leading universities ... 40 percent of partners in the leading law firms in New York and Washington ... 59 percent of the directors, writers, and producers of the 50 top-grossing motion pictures from 1965 to 1982, and 58 percent of directors, writers, and producers in two or more primetime television series.”“Hollywood at the end of the twentieth century is still an industry with a pronounced ethnic tinge. Virtually all the senior executives at the major studios are Jews. Writers, producers, and to a lesser degree directors are disproportionately Jewish -- one recent study showed the figure as high as 59 percent among top-grossing films.*
But Jews have a homeland with a rogue nuclear program while American politicans laugh at those who oppose genocide of Whites in the US. They don't need some bean-counter form of majority like you are looking for when Biden is calling himself a Zionist AND SAYING WHITES BECOMING A MINORITY IN THE US IS A GOOD THING.
We aid in them committing genocide against the Palestinians. I SMH at you folks who deny what is going on - the Palestinians are you in the future. How you can't see that is frustrating. AIPAC, the Zionist lobby in the US, has considerable lobbying strength - but in a narrow sphere revolving around foreign policy.
They are the reason for cultural marxism.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-jewish-groups-helping-muslim-refugees-accused-of-harboring-new-nazis/
https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/news/1.686976
How much money does Congress give the NRA? How much does Congress give Israel. Open your eyes.
Joe_McCarthy ago
The only part? 11% is 11%. They do comprise a larger share of the entertainment industry. There is a fair bit of reputable info documenting their role in Hollywood. But 11% of the nation's elite is not Jewish domination in my book.
I see you equate Zionism with whites losing demographic power in the US. I'm unsure what to say other than to point out that it's a bit broader than Zionists are responsible for white genocide. I've articulated a bit on some of the complicated factors elsewhere on this thread. It is not reducible to Jews.
AIPAC specifically is an Israel lobby. I don't see any mention of them in those links. Even assuming I agree with the premise that Jews are uniquely responsible for refugee lobbying (they're not - not by a long shot) one cannot point at an uninvolved group and conflate them with involved groups solely because they're all Jews. That is simply shoddy reasoning.
yergi ago
Jewish religion dictates that if your mother is Jewish, you are Jewish. Just sayin'.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Yeah, Reform Judaism even counts the paternal line. But Jews are very outnumbered. A Jew will marry a Gentile and then the half Jew progeny will also probably marry a Gentile. Pretty soon the Jewish ancestry gets more and more diluted and with increasing secularization such people will be less and less likely to identify as Jews. It might take a hundred years and we'll probably never completely absorb them. Jews themselves do very much fear this trend though.
ErrorHasNoRights ago
I think they certainly have extraordinary influence for their size in Western nations, and have for quite a long time now. Are they not the Synagogue of Satan?
And this goes beyond simply donating to Democrats because that is looking at the entire Jewish population as a whole. The less powerful Jews are hardly the problem, even if they do vote Democrat. The powerful ones influence both Democrat and Republican Parties. You have to admit that our foreign policy in the Mideast is practically following the Yinon Plan to a tee.
But I also think we allow them too much credit. To whatever extent they do rule us, it's because, through our own weaknesses, we let them.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Ordinary Jews are typically politically liberal. This means a general aversion if not hostility to public displays of Christian symbols, a negative attitude toward conservative Christians, positive attitudes toward gun control, mass immigration, etc. But that basically makes them a more anti-Christian version of Puerto Ricans. And significantly between the two of them they could soon turn Florida permanently blue. This would especially tend to be the case if we adopt the attitude as official policy that the US is in the service of Israeli expansionism - a crazy idea I have to say - as it'll put pressure on Israel and encourage more Jews to move to Florida.
As voting blocs though blacks are a much worse problem. They're a much worse problem, period. So are 'Hispanics'. Soon Muslims probably will be too.
ErrorHasNoRights ago
I guess it's a question as to whether the main problems facing the country (and the West) are voting-related and / or political. And I would argue they are not. I would say that politics is downstream of culture, and those that want to use state power for their own ends know this fact very well.
Blacks are only a "much worse problem" if your problem is worrying about getting knocked out while walking through the park.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Blacks are a significant violent crime threat, a relatively unproductive underclass that uses disproportionate sums of welfare, and an increasingly serious miscegenation threat.
Jews pose little or no threat on these fronts. Niggers are a cancer though.
ErrorHasNoRights ago
How can you say Jews pose little or no threat when they're some of the largest proponents of government debt, trillion dollar wars and immigration-invasion?
Yeah I get that we have to get welfare spending down but people don't blink an eye when it comes to the welfare that is the defense department or our endless military adventures.
Joe_McCarthy ago
The Jewish role in immigration is radically overstated. I don't doubt they usually favor it. What I do doubt is their impact in enacting it. I'm not convinced they have much impact. Certainly not compared to the business lobby or ethnic lobbies looking to bring family members in. The Catholic Church is probably even more of a mover there.
But I was speaking specifically in terms of a direct threat on miscegenation. Jews don't really pose one themselves. It's blacks mixing with us not Jews that is a threat.
If you say Jews support heavy social spending that is heavily offset by their productivity. They are about the highest earners in the country after all. Blacks though push for spending but contribute less.
And I'd hardly call Jews huge militarists. Liberals don't support huge defense budgets. American Jews were no more likely to support Iraq in polling than the American people at large.
You can say neo-con but the guy making the decisions there was some Protestant New England transplant in Texas. And in any case the war issue is not something I mentioned.
ErrorHasNoRights ago
I feel like you're putting blinders on and then saying, "I don't see Jews involved in this". Am I wrong? And while I don't think the JQ should be overstated, it seems like you're sort of doing the opposite.
Joe_McCarthy ago
I don't think so. It's not that they're uninvolved. More that they're less important than is assumed. A key weakness of them is their lack of numbers. That means a lot more than Judeo-obsessives appreciate. Thus they can be overrepresented in some bad things and yet still be greatly outnumbered. For example, lobbying for refugee intake in the US. Jewish groups do often favor that but so do most Christian churches. And the churches dwarf them in numbers. Immigration itself is a complicated process driven by demographics, population explosion, desire to move here, demand of capitalists, desire for immigrants already here to sponsor and lobby for family members, Christian humanitarianism, Democrats' need for voters, and the difficulty of defending the Mexican border. Jewish capitalists favor immigration but in their function as capitalists, not Jews, as Gentile capitalists act just like them given their similar class position of benefiting from cheap labor in a competitive market economy. And here again the lack of raw numbers constrain Jews. The large majority of such people are Gentiles even if Jews are overrepresented.
Given all of this there is little reason to focus so monomaniacally on Jews. They are intelligent liberals basically and the problems they do pose are better addressed by a general anti-liberalism rather than anti-Semitism. Anti-Semitism has a bad smell and the Judeo-obsessive, in his obsession with the Jew and only the Jew actually distorts and limits the scope of the problem.
My call isn't to ignore the issue. Only to have a proper understanding of it. What dominates on various internet platforms are superficial, meme driven ideas that are frankly idiotic and turn off people like me that are even otherwise inclined to be generally sympathetic in terms of the broader concerns the white race faces demographically.
ErrorHasNoRights ago
Overall I agree with this view.
Quaestorr ago
I was actually writing some nuanced opinion! Then, all of a sudden it was all gone.
And so will I be, again. I'll probably see y'all after 4 or 5 weeks, when I forgot how much I loath the Voat interface and format.
Skyrock ago
This is why pre-type long pieces off-line. Too many comments have been lost in hicc-ups, especially now under storm shelter conditions.
Quaestorr ago
Good idea. I used to do that on the old OE forum. Should do it here too. I was in a grumpy mood yesterday anyway:D
anthonylancer ago
Whhhhyyyy are we in this fucking subverse if OP is the creator? I now know not to come back to this particular sub
Joe_McCarthy ago
Nutzis raus.
Joe_McCarthy ago
For some reason this thread appears stuck on 33 comments despite more comments being posted. Not sure what the issue is.
Quaestorr ago
Must be because Jesus Christ was 33 when he was killed by Jews, and we're a Zionist Illuminati mind control subverse.
QueenMab_II ago
That made me laugh. BTW...Hi Quaestor..long time! <waves>
Quaestorr ago
Hey QM! I did see your name coming by every now and then but hadn't had (or took) the chance to say hello. I hope all is well :)
I should be here more often but tbh I find the Voat format not that inviting to come in to. It stimulates superficiality, and also unlike on a traditional forum older threads sink down, even if someone posts to them. But At least we can now have three stickies instead of one.
R34p_Th3_Wh0r1w1nd ago
You don't provide proof for any of your outlandish theories. Some of them are not even complete sentences. If you can provide proof of your claims I will gladly consider them.
I have come to my current views do to mountain of evidence too the contrary of your weak arguments. There is a huge repository of links of the proof on the net called, the ultimate red pill. You didn't bother providing proof, so I won't provide the link. To can take my word for it.
Maybe a taste of what you find. http://covenersleague.com/images/whocontrolsyourmind2015.jpg
Joe_McCarthy ago
I mostly provided argumentation. If you think it's an 'outlandish theory' to say Jews don't rule the world, for example, you should argue your case though. I find the notion quite amusing. Anyone who really believes that is credible should probably be presumed bonkers. They have quite a challenge to substantiate it. In contesting it I'm disputing an 'outlandish theory'.
So if you want try to tell us why Jews rule this planet earth of ours. And good luck.
GHDW ago
This is amalickmyballswhokillskids, a tribe of Dan snake-jew who slithers away when reminded of his past
Go assume a new "personality" you breathing toilet
siberyak ago
Zionism we do not see. Their complicity in certain bolshevik crimes and the war in iraq i.e. jewish neo cons was done from behind the scenes. No blood in the butchers hand.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Why should Jews be blamed for Bolshevism more than, say, Russians? There were more Russian Bolsheviks. Even among the leadership.
siberyak ago
Because they were way overrepresented for there small slice of the population.
Joe_McCarthy ago
That is not a trivial consideration but what matters most is that it happened at all. And Jews were not nearly as numerous. The Bolsheviks came to power and held it in large part because they had the support of ordinary soldiers. They had the muscle. Jews were a trivial consideration in considering these soldiers. Left to Jewish Bolsheviks alone there would have been no Communist revolution in Russia. That can probably be said for Russians too. But it was a multiethnic effort with Russians predictably playing the most numerous role.
siberyak ago
Actually they were waaay over represented in early bolshevism and I can provide you list. The jewish community was treated very poorly by the czar so maybe this was the reason
Joe_McCarthy ago
I'm very aware of the Jews in the early Bolshevik leadership. But I don't believe their role was as decisive as that of Russians' - much less the Bolsheviks as a whole.
Just out of curiosity do you believe Lenin was a Jew? He was part. But also Russian, Tatar, German, and Swedish. Culturally he identified as Russian. But maybe it was all really a Swedish conspiracy.
siberyak ago
I dont know how else to explain this to you.....sorry man. When you make up over 50 % or the revolutionaries but you are only a few percent of the population people are going to look at that as an organized attempt. A head scratcher
Joe_McCarthy ago
Only among the leadership, certainly not the soldiers needed to seize power, can that over 50% figure come remotely close to being accurate, and only then during the actual coup with the first politburo. You had three Jews out of seven there not counting Lenin. Trotsky, Kamenev, and Zinoviev, and amusingly Kamenev and Zinoviev opposed Lenin's successful bid to seize power by force with a bunch of non-Jewish (and mostly Russian) Red Guards.
Joe_McCarthy ago
People should watch this thread regularly as I'm going to keep it stickied indefinitely. This will be a sort of battlefield where we meet to rumble you might say. And I'm not exactly up against the Roman legions here.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
wow, citations needed. I think you're full of shit, and you've proided no actual evidence here to prove me wrong
Joe_McCarthy ago
I did say I was going to try to avoid going in depth in that OP. The purpose was not to write a book. I'm unsure why you were expecting footnotes or some such. But you should be specific yourself. Give me one example of where you think I was wrong and we'll discuss it.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
you were wrong all over the place, but I don't need to go point by point and prove anything as this is all just your opinion backed by nothing. So I'll respond in turn; in my opinion you are a liar, prove me wrong. Of course, it's possible you're not a liar and you're actually just ignorant, in which case I'm insulted you expect me to do research you weren't willing to do. I'll give you a hint though jews in government and banking were responsible for instigating both world war 1 and 2 as well as current conflicts in the middle east, all wars are (((bankers))) wars, and it isn't just the democrats the jews control the republican establishment as well.
Joe_McCarthy ago
So in other words you refuse my request to contest any one thing I said. I figured you'd decline. You avoid getting demolished that way.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
see these are just blatant halftruths and lies, back your shit up with evidence. It's not just about which politicians are jewish themselves it matters who they take money from. Again, you've yet to make a single actual point thus far, these are all just your own opinions and assumptions backed up by nothing. I'll be happy to prove you wrong, but so far there's no need for me to do so as you've proven nothing at all. Give me specific numbers and cite actual evidence.
Joe_McCarthy ago
You claim Jews control the Republican establishment. There is not a single Jewish Republican member of the US Senate. There is one black member though. You've made a claim. It is incumbent on you to substantiate it.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
they take money from jews and you've yet to substantiate a single claim you've made, if you're not going to take this seriously just fuck off tbh.
Joe_McCarthy ago
They take money from a lot of people.
I doubt you know how much of their campaign funds come from Jews. I know about how much it is. It's a big reason why I know your claim here is bullshit.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
you're just wasting my time, i keep telling you to provide citations. what's worse is you expect me to when you won't. What low level shilling, kill yourself.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Your talk of citations is ridiculous. You made a claim. Put up or shut up.
You obviously don't much here. You're some people that has convinced himself j00z run everything. I've spoken in details you couldn't hope to halfway match.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
that's what my first comment was you faggot. You provide nothing but expect something, kill yourself shill
Joe_McCarthy ago
Yeah, you wanted footnotes or some shit. It's bullshit we've already been over.
Still waiting for anything from you that is remotely convincing regarding your claim Jews control the Republican establishment. We'll be waiting a long time I reckon.
Tell ya what... what percentage of GOP campaign funds come from Jews? If you keep evading we're all going to know you don't know the answer.
I'll wait. Maybe Google can help.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. So to your submission and all your replies i say you're wrong. If you'd like to dispute that bring evidence, as i've maintianed from the start i'll start taking this seriously when you do.
Joe_McCarthy ago
More evasion. You claim Jews control the Republican establishment. I asked you how much of GOP campaign funds come from Jews. The record will show that you will not or cannot answer. Your claim about the Republican establishment remains nonsense.
Have a nice afternoon.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
i can easily back that up, but i refuse to since you won't back ANY of your shit up. I hate shills and i hate hypocrits and you're clearly both. Kill yourself.
jewshekelstein1488 ago
it seems to me this post and the op are not genuine. there is a mountain of evidence available that contradicts everything you wrote. you obviously know how to use the internet so if you haven't done the research or dismiss the evidence this indicates you have a bias. in that case there isn't likely to be any chance i can change your mind by showing you facts and evidence because we have already established that isn't the issue. and so i can only conclude you are here to argue and divert and waste our time. sorry i'm not taking the bait but thank you for exposing yourself as a kike or a shabbos goyim. i'll be sure to rate your future posts and comments accordingly.
Joe_McCarthy ago
A 'mountain of evidence' that contradicts the idea that American Jews are mostly liberal then? You did say 'everything' I wrote is subject to such 'evidence' so either we can just say you're subject to bullshit exaggerations or you can retract or substantiate your claim.
jewshekelstein1488 ago
@crensch @rellik88 @kevdude @trigglypuff
meh. i could waste a bunch of my precious time to provide sources and refute all of your bullshit kikery but we all know where this is going so i have a better idea. instead i will simply tell you a story.
siberyak ago
American jews have great political, media and monetary influences for just being 2% of the us population. Certainly the clinton administration wasnt full of buddists
Crensch ago
Thank you for the ping, @european.
@Joe_McCarthy may you live forever under the Jewish yoke, and if Jewish, smell bitter almonds in your restless sleep until it finally happens for real.
I have a massive amount of archived material on these subjects, and much of it unsorted. Below I present the findings within the first 200 of my unsorted 3,232 items.
As mentioned elsewhere, this is horseshit. The only reason the native populations have allowed this all to happen is because JEWS own their media, because if an actual human owned/ran some media, they'd have been thoroughly outraged by what's happening.
Bullshit since being the sole driving force behind the invasion of Europe and the US is JEWS, meaning they're waging a war on WHITE countries that they are allowed to infiltrate.
Lucky for you, the first couple hundred items I went through had nothing on this, however, who runs those banks if not for the only people ever accused or described as running those banks? Someone else here had a quote from Amschel Rothschild more or less declaring his intent.
HAHAHAHAHA Seriously? Of all the Jewish shit you had to pick, you picked this one? Jews are literally the only reason the Bolshevik Genocide happened, you fucking kike.
Another insanely laughable one. Henry Ford lists out what they control, are you saying he lied? Why do we give so many gibs to Israel, Jew? Why don't we ask Truman?
Why don't we just ask a bunch of important people in the past?
@kevdude @Trigglypuff @jewshekelstein1488
jewshekelstein1488 ago
this faggot is just a shill looking to waste our time. presenting evidence is not going to change anything. downgoat and move on.
Joe_McCarthy ago
More like you're paranoid conspiracy theorists wasting the time of everyone on Voat. It takes more time to refute bullshit than to produce it though so this blizzard of bullshit we've seen on this thread will take time to address. I'll address it though and this thread will remain stickied. Y'all just downvote. Because beyond your shitty arguments it's all you've got.
siberyak ago
Well you started this thread and if nothing else explain why jews have been expelled from nation after nation and kingdom after kingdom? Its something close to 100 expulsions. Are these expulsions due to irrational anti semites are due to their own behavior?
Joe_McCarthy ago
Pretty complicated issue, that. Jews got kicked out of Spain for collaborating with the Moors. They controlled Moorish finances. By the same token Jews had earlier helped finance parts of the reconquista. Would I have kicked them out? Probably.
Then you had a case like the Rintfleisch pogrom in Bavaria. Jews were rumored to have engaged in host desecration. Most Jew haters today wouldn't even know what that is. But should Jews have been killed by mobs over the desecration of a host? Maybe that was thought legitimate in the Age of Faith but Jews were attacked by mobs for the supposed actions of an individual or a few people. Seems to be, erm, overkill, no?
In general though Jews were easy to kick out. They were few in numbers. Lots of Huguenots got kicked out of France too.
They got attacked by Cossacks for being aligned with Poles. They got attacked by Greek nationalists for being aligned with Turks. And why did they get kicked out of England? Maybe so Edward I could seize their property for involved reasons? Maybe it was a confluence of factors? Why did they get along reasonably well in the Netherlands but not in Russia?
There are no easy, one size fits all answers here.
Crensch ago
@Rainy-Day-Dream @Hey_Sunshine @heygeorge @gabara @RM-Goetbbels
See OP
Brigbjones ago
Remember that it's impossible to be loved by everyone and hated by none. However, it's easy to be hated by everyone and loved by none.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Yeah, true. Personally I'm comfortable occupying a middle ground between conspiracy kooks and angry, neurotic Jews apt to treat any criticism with a jerk of the knee. It just uses up a lot of time responding to bad arguments from both sides.
Skyrock ago
If Jews were responsible for even a quarter of the deeds they have been attributed to, their power would outstrip the effort of the entire remainder of mankind by several magnitudes. If they were that powerful and had that much targeted malice, they would have switched to open warfare and extermination a long time ago.
At least then you would expect them to be able to keep their own nation Israel politically stable, not a mess of Italian proportions that has its government coalition falling apart every two years on average. To me that doesn't exactly convince me of the ability of Jews to unite behind a common cause and stay on course about it, and it certainly isn't testament to their skill in pulling strings in other countries.
Another important fact that judeo-obsessives seem to be ignorant about is the role of Jews in the foundation of Fascism. Many of the thinkers, officers and other high-ups of Italian Fascism have been Jews, and they never received any attacks until Italy was turned into a German vassal state. They certainly played a much, much greater role there than they ever did in Soviet Russia.
jewshekelstein1488 ago
false equivalence fallacy. just because they are good at scheming and infiltrating and stealing doesn't mean they are any good at running a stable country. plus the fact that they stole the land and have been at war with their neighbors since day zero doesn't help.
Rellik88 ago
Really? You sure?
Right because we want to go to war with Iran because they might attack the US right? Whos helping the refugees get to Europe, enatcing the laws to allow it, and going on media endorsing it? Thats right Mormans... Also what happens every time a country want to sell oil in Gold? Syria, Libya, Iran, N Korea, Iraq?
Yep richest people in the known world for century's have no power.
http://humansarefree.com/2013/11/complete-list-of-banks-ownedcontrolled.html
https://www.marxist.com/bolshevism-the-road-to-revolution.htm http://www.heretical.com/miscellx/bolshies.html
Your telling me the Xtains are not tripping over themselves to help Israel? Member when TX made you not boycott ISrael to get hurricane relief funds? Or the Billions we give them? Or the fact they attack one of our ships, and it swept under the rug? Come one we are not that blind.
I'm sorry but the Zionists are making it fucking obvious. They are so filled with pride they are boasting about it.
Tell me Joe why is Israel allowed an Ethnostate? Why do they murder brown people yet are not racist? Why did they play boths sides of WWI and WWII? To get Israel of course, gave ya that one for free. Why where Jews HATED all through history? I know everyone is a Nazi right? Even the Egyptians.
Joe_McCarthy ago
They have a list of banks supposed owned or controlled by the Rothschilds. No external sources. No footnotes. They just say it. I might as well just list here that the Bank of Afghanistan is owned by some person.
Needless to say, humansarefree.com is a fringe conspiracy site but it's also been flagged as a clickbait site - which means it takes stories with some truth in them and embellishes them.
http://fakenewswatch.com/
It also promotes things like germ theory denial and alien structures on Mars:
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Humans_Are_Free
You and others around here would really do well to try and rely on reputable sources... or at least do a bit of cross-referencing when reading something from a fringe website.
More later...
Joe_McCarthy ago
That chart has numerous questionable claims or outright inaccuracies. Who is dumb enough to think Ron Howard is Jewish for example? Opie was a kike? Lulz.
There's some discussion going over this chart here:
https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/19974/are-american-media-controlled-mostly-by-jews
This meme list, like all such lists, should be treated with skepticism as well. But without bothering to look at the accuracy of it CNN is not the entirety of the American media. Obviously.
We haven't gone to war with Iran despite a good bit of saber rattling from pro-Israel partisans. If anything that argues against your argument.
Angela Merkel? I mean, you asked who is 'enatcing' the laws. European law is not made by Jews. European parliaments are overwhelmingly non-Jewish. Hard to believe frankly that this even need be pointed out. Also, it is not just Jews that are involved in pro-refugee activities.
In any case I have no idea how this is supposed to substantiate how Jews 'control the world'. Makes no sense.
A conspiracy theory involving these countries proves what exactly?
Yep richest people in the known world for century's have no power.
List of top ten wealthiest families in the world. Rothschilds are not on the list:
https://www.therichest.com/rich-list/world/the-top-10-richest-families-in-the-world/
It's questionable whether he even said it. But even if so how does a quote from the 19th century establish that Rothschilds own the central banks of the world in 2017?
I'll address more of your post as time permits.
EarlPoncho ago
@Joe_McCarthy may be paul joseph watson
Joe_McCarthy ago
I've been accused of being this dude.
https://20committee.com/about/
EarlPoncho ago
it seems people confuse you with a beta male
KosherHiveKicker ago
Don't bother to engage @Jew_McKikethy
He is just going to "NUH UH" any source, or point you make against his overt defense of Zionist-Jews.
1Sorry_SOB ago
You have superficial knowledge that leads you to discount much of the verifiable truth.
I agree some things get exaggerated but once you dig deep enough into, let's call it hidden knowledge, it is undisputable that Jews over at least 100 years are waging war on white society which for some reason they have an aversion to. I don't know if it is out of simple malice, self-preservation or if it's just genetic.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
why should we even try to get along? there's only around 18 million jews on earth right now, 3 actual holocausts and the problem is solved forever
Joe_McCarthy ago
Right. Mexicans go away. Africans stop breeding like cockroaches. The over 100 million non-whites in the US go away. And the Muslim demographic explosion between now and 2050 suddenly ends.
Problem solved if we just gas the kikes.
Rainy-Day-Dream ago
yes, literally all those problems go back to the frankfurt school and cultural marxism. Until a few decades ago this country and most 1st world countries were overwhelmingly majority white instead of 50-60% but jewish activists, ceos, bankers, and politicians pushed for non-white immigration. Really if we just cut off foreign aid and stop being "tolerant" none of those problems are difficult to solve
100LinksToGunter ago
Because generally speaking the people that try to suppress you will face the heat first.
It's illegal to discriminate against jews / muslims in a lot of countries now.
It's not illegal to discriminate against Christianity or whites.
The people you cannot criticize own you.
Joe_McCarthy ago
We seem unable to criticize trannies nowadays. I don't feel owned by Bruce Jenner.
100LinksToGunter ago
They have only been rammed in the media for about 5 years? or so. It takes a while to convince an entire generation that everything they've learned is wrong. If it keeps getting pushed then in 10-20 years it will be illegal to question it.
I mean shit, you have to use the correct pronoun in Canada now or face a good old buggering from the state.
Omar_Mateen ago
Found the jew
HarlandKornfeld14 ago
Well, look at who is behind the Frankfurt School, also referred to as Cultural Marxism.
(((Theodore Adorno))), (((Max Horkheimer))), (((Walter Benjamin))), (((Herbert Marcuse))), (((Erich Fromm)) — all major formulators of this ideology are Jews.
Joe_McCarthy ago
And how important is the Frankfurt School? Not very.
Lafall ago
that an Irish name or you just bashing the Anti-Communist nut Joseph who went on Russian/Socialist witch hunts
Joe_McCarthy ago
I'm a big fan of the New York Giants baseball manager.
1Sorry_SOB ago
Joe I would disagree. It set in motion the belief that all races are equal for the western world. This was a huge sea change.
HarlandKornfeld14 ago
It certainly works to crank out a lot of Red Guards in our university system.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Does it necessarily? Marcuse was influential on campus in the 60s but nothing like that now. What tends to predominate now is a more virulent strain of ideology centered around things that Horkheimer was drawn on for inspiration but was not himself involved in. Just darkening demographics should not be discounted as a source for student radicalism either.
HarlandKornfeld14 ago
My interpretation of Cultural Marxism is a critical cultural deconstructivism, attacking traditional cultural structures that allow a society to remain cohesive. A lot of Cultural Marxist literally is as boring as sandpaper and tediously verbose.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Well, yeah, that is the critical theory component. Horkheimer. It tends to deconstruct authority by questioning its legitimacy and by doing so undermining traditional institutions. But what we see on campus now is not reducible to that and that is a forerunner of the virulent movement to deconstruct whiteness in the effort to fight 'white supremacy'.
So the Frankfurt School isn't irrelevant but it is mostly one of them, the founder, that is relevant, and he has been used in much the same way Alain Locke used a more innocuous figure, William James, to craft multiculturalism.
HarlandKornfeld14 ago
Well, I always thought Cultural Marxism was mostly from Adorno. So the stuff about Horkheimer is at least something I didn't know before. So it still serves to deconstruct Whiteness and traditionalism.
Joe_McCarthy ago
Adorno was responsible for that American Jewish Committee publication 'The Authoritarian Personality' which basically equated conservative attitudes with Fascism. But it is not merely enough to say something is a toxic product. It is necessary to demonstrate its influence in actually doing harm.
HarlandKornfeld14 ago
Well, this meme is everywhere on the Left and it is entrenched pretty deeply.
Joe_McCarthy ago
More or less, yes. But mostly in the last few years. A general tendency on the left to call opponents fascists was absent even as recently as the Bush years. Can we say this all came out of 'The Authoritarian Personality'? Why should we? Why couldn't left-wingers come up with such a smear independently of a somewhat nondescript Jewish intellectual?
475677 ago
The lower jews are just as susceptible to the zog propaganda as the rest of us so fuck off you kike shill.
european ago
@crensch @eagleshigh