The way I understand this (and there was another thread a few weeks ago) is that Dershowitz & Cernovich are working together to get the original case by Virginia Roberts against Epstein unsealed even though she was a minor. I believe it is to use against Virginia - or maybe one of the Jane Doe's that are currently suing Epstein - since she also said she was made to have sex with Dershowitz.
Here is a letter from Virginia's attorney laying out the relationship between Dershowitz & Cernovich...
An intervenor can join either side and in this context I'd have to assume Dershowitz joined the Defendant Maxwell and Cernovich the plaintiff (Virginia).
The doc nr and date don't match the doc Quantokitty and I were talking about. So this is another Motion to Quash, likely by another subpoenaed party.
I don't know whether Intervenors can be subpoenaed themselves in these cases, but whoever it is, as Intervenor in the case Cernovich and Counsel should know damn well that this has nothing to do with them being sued.
I think this is a good way to see which side everyone is on. Anyone against Virginia is against pizzagate. SHE IS THE VICTIM. SHE IS WHO WE ARE WORKING FOR.
I'm no lawyer but/and I've never been a fan of Cernovich. Wasn't sure I would post this or where so I'm tagging onto your comment.
How do we actually know that anything he says about anything is even true?
If it is true, why not have found a lawyer that was one of us who would have done it for free
If it is true, why not file pro se (you file on your own without a lawyer involved.)
I don't like anything, whether direct or indirect that smacks of "I need more money. "
Here's all i needed to read from him. ..
"Pedophiles are afraid, and legal costs are mounting."
"I have been funding this lawsuit with help from my Patreon backers. My attorney Marc Randazza billed me at a 50% discount due to the importance of this matter.
Jeffrey Epstein is a billionaire who should be in prison for life. He bought his way out of prison, and now he’s trying to spend his way out of this case by filing costly legal papers against me.
100% of contributions will go towards the legal defense fund.
Become a monthly donor on Patreon.
Make a contribution via BitCoin on CoinBase
Or fund the news via PayPal."
My take:
There are people on this v/ who are working one or more jobs who are really getting things done - digging deep in their free time and ask for nothing.
Put a computer camera in front of your face, sound serious and righteous and caring, repeat info you find here, on the Chans or from other youtubers, upload it to you tube, monetize it, declare yourself an "investigative journalist" over and over again, and come up with reasons. ... very possibly manufactured about why you need money. .. "It's going to the cause" and the cash flows in. Only takes about 30 minutes a day.
Cernovich is an attorney himself. Licensed in the State of California. And, as others have said...he is quite rich from a very lucrative alimony settlement. The dude is pure ego, vanity, narcissism, and self-promotion. And that's best case. Avoid at all costs.
That was my initial thought as well. He's trying to scoop up a bunch of donations. Since the whole thing is complicated legalese, most people aren't able to figure out what's going on. By the time they do, he'll already have everyone's money.
Well, look at the Plaintiff and Defendant. Cernovich's name wasn't on there. Was he a party to this action? Did he put into have access to what Ghislaine Maxwell says if she's forced to testify? He would get a copy of affidavit if that were the case, and the testimony might be redacted because it's ongoing litigation. It's the same case number, I think. I glanced at it so I hope it saw what I think i saw. But even without finding it online, a look at the Plaintiff/Defendant does not show Epstein as the complainant or Cernovich as the defendant.
I really think he got rattled. There's been a lot going on and he might of forgotten requesting records. I'm more wondering if there was a final determination, and if not, what's going on. Cernovich's attorney would definitely be able to find that out.
It's an honest mistake. It shows what pressure these guys are under.
He is? I don't know. I've followed him for a long time and he's been a stand up guy. Maybe sleep deprivation? He and his wife just had that baby. I don't know what to say. It does seem like he'd at least at the Plaintiff and Defendant in the case. No, wait! It has to be an honest mistake because he's blasted this all over the internet! If it turns out that this has absolutely nothing to do with him (and it appears that it doesn't and that the papers are only copies of court proceedings), then he's going to have to say that. No one would put themselves in that position. It would be better to say you're sued, not show anything, but the envelope, and never be proven wrong.
I don't mean to sound harsh but this pisses me off. I've been on the fence about him for a while but the incidents like this keep piling up. Clicks. It's always the clicks and numbers to him.
I wanted to trust him early on because he seemed on the side of gg but too much has happened. His changing ideologies and denying he said or tweeted something when the archives and screenshots exist finally made me see that he's fundamentally dishonest.
Dershowitz was in his film "Silenced" check his timeline, they're friends. I've been following him for several years and too many odd things to trust him. I'm not law savvy but I believe many here are and this looks bad. He does not need money at all. He has bragged for years about the alimony he receives from his ex-wife, I believe it was $5000 per month, and then his book made quite a bit too. He refers cases to other lawyers and takes a third though I don't believe he passed the bar. That might have changed recently but I don't think so, I would have heard. He is more concerned with "brand" and metrics than anything and his ideology is whatever is profitable. He glommed onto the gamergate thing a couple years ago and made his name that way. Then he was alt-right, then he claimed he never was but tweets exist that prove it. he is a deleter of evidence when that evidence contradicts his stance of the day. You may see a lot of twitter accounts mocking/satirizing him and there's good reason for that. He is essentially dishonest. Above all, do not give him money. He is rich, his wife comes from money and he has a very large income at present.
What kind of pussy brags about getting 5k/mo from his ex-wife...and then writes a book called Gorilla Mindset. That, right there, tells me all I need to know.
I didn't know about the alimony. Thanks for the alimony. He definitely is concerned with brand, but I've seen him put himself out there. I just can't see him doing this publicity and posting those docs. Seems like more a mistake, but that's me.
I just checked and people have been replying with the same info and no response. He just pointed them to an earlier article. Already on to something else. But I guess his analytics look good after all those clicks.
If he's blowing this off without acknowledging he got it wrong, it's not good. I just went to the blog and I don't see anybody pointing this out. I also see that he's still talking about raising money to fight this? Fight what? Have no idea what's going on. Very strange.
I looked there. I see one of two vague comments ... nothing he'd understand.They look like shill comments (they're not ... but to him they look like shill comments.) He's still talking about it not being a scanning error. I can't believe no one close to him hasn't made a cal and told him to just pull those tweets and not go down this road.
There are plenty, you haven't looked far enough. Hundreds of replies. If he pulls those tweets now then the people who have been monitoring his other many pulled tweets will plaster pics of them onto his timeline. He knows this and will probably just let this slide.
You're missing the point. I don't have time to comb through the comments ... I'm sure someone else noticed what I did. But I'm betting he doesn't have time either or is just brushing the comments to the side as being shill posts. They're actually trying to help. I get it ... you get it ... he doesn't get it. It's why a friend needs to drag him aside and tell him to stop.
People HAVE tried. His ego is huge and he tends to block people and then claim they're paid trolls. Right after the mega thread on this started he tweeted that he has insider info that trolls will be false flagging him and to not believe anything they say. It happens again and again, that is what I'm trying to tell you. At what point, after seeing this play out in the same fashion, over and over, do you finally start to wonder about his integrity?
Well, you're putting a lot of weight in my opinion. My answer to all of the above is that I'll see how I feel when I find out how he ultimately deals with this. At some point, he has to realize the mistake he's made so we'll see what he does. Right now, like you and I both said, he's treating all negative opinions as troll comments. So we'll see. If in a month, he's still asking for money. Or in two months. If he is, and that blog post hasn't changed and there's no explanation and caveat added to explain, it'll be problematic. Thanks.
The Defendant is Ghislaine Maxwell and the plaintiff is Virginia Roberts (who was serially abused by Epstein). Churcher (who broke the Epstein story) was subpoenaed by Defendant, but refused to testify on grounds of reporters' privilege.
Absolutely NO connection to or even mention of Cernovich, or it must be in the ten redacted lines of this 20 page doc. Still absolutely nothing supporting his notion that he's being sued.
He mentions seeking legal counsel. Well that would have told him straight away that this has nothing to do with him. Sorry I can't see an honest mistake here.
It would seem to be. I think his saying he sought legal counsel was a bluff ... none of us are in positions to run to lawyers at the drop of a hat. I do think he got this one wrong.
view the rest of the comments →
quantokitty ago
Just saw this. It doesn't look like you're being sued. Not sure where you're getting that idea. Motion to Quash seems to be pertaining to the subpoena served to Ghislaine Maxwell. Here's the text online in pdf format. It appears to be the same case number: https://cases.justia.com/federal/district-courts/new-york/nysdce/1:2015cv07433/447706/503/0.pdf
Singleservename ago
So this pertains to Churcher not Cernovich? Now I'm confused.
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
He is listed, along with Alan Dershowitz, as Intervenors (?) http://pizzagate.wiki/images/1/1c/Giuffre_v._Maxwell_SDNY_CM_ECF_Version_6.1.pdf
The way I understand this (and there was another thread a few weeks ago) is that Dershowitz & Cernovich are working together to get the original case by Virginia Roberts against Epstein unsealed even though she was a minor. I believe it is to use against Virginia - or maybe one of the Jane Doe's that are currently suing Epstein - since she also said she was made to have sex with Dershowitz.
Here is a letter from Virginia's attorney laying out the relationship between Dershowitz & Cernovich...
http://pizzagate.wiki/images/7/72/Response_in_Opposition_to_Motion_to_Intervene_-_by_Mike_Cernovich.pdf
Cernovich is a "bad hombre!"
Piscina ago
Then why is Cernovich pretending to be one of the good guys? Sounds like he- along with Dershowitz--is attacking the victims of Epstein?
party1981 ago
Why is Cernovich working with Alan D., when it is pretty obvious that Alan was one of the perpetrators?
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
That's a question you would have to ask him. But I think it's pretty clear.
party1981 ago
Jesus. I liked Cernovich. I posted his stuff on facebook. This feels like such a betrayal.
Singleservename ago
An intervenor can join either side and in this context I'd have to assume Dershowitz joined the Defendant Maxwell and Cernovich the plaintiff (Virginia).
The doc nr and date don't match the doc Quantokitty and I were talking about. So this is another Motion to Quash, likely by another subpoenaed party.
I don't know whether Intervenors can be subpoenaed themselves in these cases, but whoever it is, as Intervenor in the case Cernovich and Counsel should know damn well that this has nothing to do with them being sued.
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
Also, Cernovich went to law school (inspired by Dershowitz btw) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Cernovich
You would think he would know this isn't a lawsuit :(
If anyone is part of the deep state here, it's Mike Cernovich. I mean along with Epstein, Maxwell & Dershowitz.
TomDrew87 ago
He's just trying to flog money off the general public lol
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
Dershowitz & Cernovich are definitely on the same side - https://porkinspolicyreview.files.wordpress.com/2017/02/intervenor-alan-dershowitz-memorandum-of-law-in-support-of-michael-cervnovich-motion-to-unseal.pdf
And it's against the victim:
http://pizzagate.wiki/images/7/72/Response_in_Opposition_to_Motion_to_Intervene_-_by_Mike_Cernovich.pdf
Yates ago
https://imgur.com/a/CpLiL
Singleservename ago
Fucking hell you are right. That Cernovich is one of THEM and this is some cruel joke on Virginia's expense. But that begs the question
WHY THE FUCK IS THIS POST STILL UP/NOT FLARED DEBUNKED?????
@Millennial_Falcon @Vindicator
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
THANK YOU!!!!
I think this is a good way to see which side everyone is on. Anyone against Virginia is against pizzagate. SHE IS THE VICTIM. SHE IS WHO WE ARE WORKING FOR.
zzvoat ago
I'm no lawyer but/and I've never been a fan of Cernovich. Wasn't sure I would post this or where so I'm tagging onto your comment.
If it is true, why not have found a lawyer that was one of us who would have done it for free
If it is true, why not file pro se (you file on your own without a lawyer involved.)
I don't like anything, whether direct or indirect that smacks of "I need more money. "
Here's all i needed to read from him. ..
"Pedophiles are afraid, and legal costs are mounting."
"I have been funding this lawsuit with help from my Patreon backers. My attorney Marc Randazza billed me at a 50% discount due to the importance of this matter.
Jeffrey Epstein is a billionaire who should be in prison for life. He bought his way out of prison, and now he’s trying to spend his way out of this case by filing costly legal papers against me.
100% of contributions will go towards the legal defense fund.
My take:
There are people on this v/ who are working one or more jobs who are really getting things done - digging deep in their free time and ask for nothing.
Put a computer camera in front of your face, sound serious and righteous and caring, repeat info you find here, on the Chans or from other youtubers, upload it to you tube, monetize it, declare yourself an "investigative journalist" over and over again, and come up with reasons. ... very possibly manufactured about why you need money. .. "It's going to the cause" and the cash flows in. Only takes about 30 minutes a day.
Frankly, I think it's a racket.
Proii_Pariah ago
Cernovich is an attorney himself. Licensed in the State of California. And, as others have said...he is quite rich from a very lucrative alimony settlement. The dude is pure ego, vanity, narcissism, and self-promotion. And that's best case. Avoid at all costs.
TomDrew87 ago
How dumb does someone have to be to believe this Cernovich clown
roundhouse1776 ago
That was my initial thought as well. He's trying to scoop up a bunch of donations. Since the whole thing is complicated legalese, most people aren't able to figure out what's going on. By the time they do, he'll already have everyone's money.
Yates ago
Cernovich is very rich, always has been. He has no need at all to beg for money. This is all very suspicious.
Mrs_Ogynist01 ago
He's asking for money? Fucking asshole! Did you read this? http://pizzagate.wiki/images/7/72/Response_in_Opposition_to_Motion_to_Intervene_-_by_Mike_Cernovich.pdf
Singleservename ago
Well that's a depressing thought: 133 upvoats and counting. No moderation. No flares.
If true this sub is both heavily compromised and flooded with fools.
Fuck
quantokitty ago
Well, look at the Plaintiff and Defendant. Cernovich's name wasn't on there. Was he a party to this action? Did he put into have access to what Ghislaine Maxwell says if she's forced to testify? He would get a copy of affidavit if that were the case, and the testimony might be redacted because it's ongoing litigation. It's the same case number, I think. I glanced at it so I hope it saw what I think i saw. But even without finding it online, a look at the Plaintiff/Defendant does not show Epstein as the complainant or Cernovich as the defendant.
Singleservename ago
Case number matches you're spot on. No coincidence here.
Makes me wonder what this Cernovich is up to though.
quantokitty ago
I really think he got rattled. There's been a lot going on and he might of forgotten requesting records. I'm more wondering if there was a final determination, and if not, what's going on. Cernovich's attorney would definitely be able to find that out.
It's an honest mistake. It shows what pressure these guys are under.
Yates ago
Cernovich IS an attorney. I don't think this is an honest mistake.
TomDrew87 ago
Lol
quantokitty ago
He is? I don't know. I've followed him for a long time and he's been a stand up guy. Maybe sleep deprivation? He and his wife just had that baby. I don't know what to say. It does seem like he'd at least at the Plaintiff and Defendant in the case. No, wait! It has to be an honest mistake because he's blasted this all over the internet! If it turns out that this has absolutely nothing to do with him (and it appears that it doesn't and that the papers are only copies of court proceedings), then he's going to have to say that. No one would put themselves in that position. It would be better to say you're sued, not show anything, but the envelope, and never be proven wrong.
Yates ago
I don't mean to sound harsh but this pisses me off. I've been on the fence about him for a while but the incidents like this keep piling up. Clicks. It's always the clicks and numbers to him.
roundhouse1776 ago
Long before this, I've heard a lot of stuff that said not to trust Cernovich, that's he's controlled disinfo.
Yates ago
I wanted to trust him early on because he seemed on the side of gg but too much has happened. His changing ideologies and denying he said or tweeted something when the archives and screenshots exist finally made me see that he's fundamentally dishonest.
quantokitty ago
You can sound harsh if you want. If that's how you feel, it's how you feel. There could have been a little jumping the gun in there. Who knows?
Yates ago
Dershowitz was in his film "Silenced" check his timeline, they're friends. I've been following him for several years and too many odd things to trust him. I'm not law savvy but I believe many here are and this looks bad. He does not need money at all. He has bragged for years about the alimony he receives from his ex-wife, I believe it was $5000 per month, and then his book made quite a bit too. He refers cases to other lawyers and takes a third though I don't believe he passed the bar. That might have changed recently but I don't think so, I would have heard. He is more concerned with "brand" and metrics than anything and his ideology is whatever is profitable. He glommed onto the gamergate thing a couple years ago and made his name that way. Then he was alt-right, then he claimed he never was but tweets exist that prove it. he is a deleter of evidence when that evidence contradicts his stance of the day. You may see a lot of twitter accounts mocking/satirizing him and there's good reason for that. He is essentially dishonest. Above all, do not give him money. He is rich, his wife comes from money and he has a very large income at present.
Vindicator ago
What kind of pussy brags about getting 5k/mo from his ex-wife...and then writes a book called Gorilla Mindset. That, right there, tells me all I need to know.
quantokitty ago
I didn't know about the alimony. Thanks for the alimony. He definitely is concerned with brand, but I've seen him put himself out there. I just can't see him doing this publicity and posting those docs. Seems like more a mistake, but that's me.
Yates ago
Has he responded to or explained the points made in this thread?
quantokitty ago
I haven't even checked. Does he even know this is posted? He may not.
Yates ago
I just checked and people have been replying with the same info and no response. He just pointed them to an earlier article. Already on to something else. But I guess his analytics look good after all those clicks.
quantokitty ago
If he's blowing this off without acknowledging he got it wrong, it's not good. I just went to the blog and I don't see anybody pointing this out. I also see that he's still talking about raising money to fight this? Fight what? Have no idea what's going on. Very strange.
Yates ago
Look at the comments under the two tweets he made about this. Lawyers and others are in there calling him out for the discrepancies. https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/837745962445570049 https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/837748241634635776
quantokitty ago
I looked there. I see one of two vague comments ... nothing he'd understand.They look like shill comments (they're not ... but to him they look like shill comments.) He's still talking about it not being a scanning error. I can't believe no one close to him hasn't made a cal and told him to just pull those tweets and not go down this road.
Yates ago
There are plenty, you haven't looked far enough. Hundreds of replies. If he pulls those tweets now then the people who have been monitoring his other many pulled tweets will plaster pics of them onto his timeline. He knows this and will probably just let this slide.
quantokitty ago
You're missing the point. I don't have time to comb through the comments ... I'm sure someone else noticed what I did. But I'm betting he doesn't have time either or is just brushing the comments to the side as being shill posts. They're actually trying to help. I get it ... you get it ... he doesn't get it. It's why a friend needs to drag him aside and tell him to stop.
Yates ago
People HAVE tried. His ego is huge and he tends to block people and then claim they're paid trolls. Right after the mega thread on this started he tweeted that he has insider info that trolls will be false flagging him and to not believe anything they say. It happens again and again, that is what I'm trying to tell you. At what point, after seeing this play out in the same fashion, over and over, do you finally start to wonder about his integrity?
quantokitty ago
Well, you're putting a lot of weight in my opinion. My answer to all of the above is that I'll see how I feel when I find out how he ultimately deals with this. At some point, he has to realize the mistake he's made so we'll see what he does. Right now, like you and I both said, he's treating all negative opinions as troll comments. So we'll see. If in a month, he's still asking for money. Or in two months. If he is, and that blog post hasn't changed and there's no explanation and caveat added to explain, it'll be problematic. Thanks.
Singleservename ago
The Defendant is Ghislaine Maxwell and the plaintiff is Virginia Roberts (who was serially abused by Epstein). Churcher (who broke the Epstein story) was subpoenaed by Defendant, but refused to testify on grounds of reporters' privilege.
Absolutely NO connection to or even mention of Cernovich, or it must be in the ten redacted lines of this 20 page doc. Still absolutely nothing supporting his notion that he's being sued.
He mentions seeking legal counsel. Well that would have told him straight away that this has nothing to do with him. Sorry I can't see an honest mistake here.
@Vindicator this ought to be flared DEBUNKED
Vindicator ago
Did it.
quantokitty ago
It would seem to be. I think his saying he sought legal counsel was a bluff ... none of us are in positions to run to lawyers at the drop of a hat. I do think he got this one wrong.