If the game is rigged, can we have free speech on Voat? (ProtectVoat)

submitted ago by Scandinavian

Hi guys!

I was having a discussion with resident shill @kevdude in PMs about free speech on Voat and thought it was worth asking all of you to join. So here goes!

It's 2015: SJW time

Some of you might remember when Voat was in alpha, back in 2015. The SJWs moved in as Ellen Gong Phat Pao was doing the dirty work on Reddit and people were migrating over here. As you know, SJWs always follow to censor the free exchange of ideas. A little cunt in particular by the name of 'she' was quickly raking in mod positions. AskVoat - the most active verse at the time - was being censored left and right.

SJWs are like parasites: if you have something valuable, they'll try to suck the blood out of it

At the time, the culture here was still mirroring Reddit. At the same time, Voat was set to be the next big thing. We made PV to run the SJWs out of town by making sure they wouldn't have a quiet moment until free speech was guaranteed here. We won a lot of short-term battles then, and the likes of 'she' are nowhere to be found as verse owners.

I stopped believing in higher ideals. I think you have to fight fire with fire napalm

What ultimately made me leave PV was a strong disagreement between myself and another moderator on one side and @kevdude and @crensch on the other. I've later understood I'd run into the same problem over and over again:

I don't believe in free speech unless the playing field is level. I now believe you have to fight the SJWs (and other parasites who want to control other people's lives) by beating them with their own weapons first. Then, when everyone sees the value of free exchange of ideas, you can have that.

Voat is not a level playing field. And it's losing, big time

The current rules of the site (still) allow for shills and brigaders to push agendas into common spaces. Meanwhile, it seems what was ultimately a free speech place made itself irrelevant by allowing drama to take over where the SJWs left off. Voat is much less relevant today than it was in 2015.

If ProtectVoat is really here to protect Voat, we should set a new direction

We started this discussion before the recent blackout. It highlighted its necessity, though. If there is to be a Voat that does something other than provide a place to yell kikeniggerfaggot in (with no clout beyond our own reach whatsoever), I think it's time for major change. As of 2018, I would personally think a place like PV should support and fight for something else. Because the game is rigged anyway.

  • I don't believe whatever drama group (including this one) should set the rules for niche subverses.
  • I believe verse owners should have the right to moderate as they see fit, as long as there's at least five-ten non-moderated general interest verses.
  • I believe Protect Voat should actively fight to have a full-time admin overseeing that the site isn't manipulated.
  • I believe Nazis and SJWs are two sides of the same coin (people who want to control others' lives) and should be treated alike
  • I think Voat could do so much more to advance universal ideas of freedom - at all levels from universities to global institutions - if verses were allowed to run with frameworks set by verse owners.
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Crensch ago

I believe Nazis and SJWs are two sides of the same coin (people who want to control others' lives) and should be treated alike

Not currently interested in the rest of your post, but this really stood out.

Explain how this isn't a false-equivalence, and then explain how "Nazis" want to control others' lives.

Cannonfodder ago

I kinda see it as holding any kind of ideology is essentially mind-control by yourself. Anyone can be persuaded to one idealogy or another which can be reinforced by the power of social conformity. It is easier on an individual’s mind and for the individual to trust pre-formed ideologies especially those established in a society than to have the fortitude to recognize the mental constructs in place and their mind-controlling ability and either accept or reject them and form their own internal concepts of the world.

Crensch ago

http://archive.is/vOBqV

This just gets better and better. A response to the ADDED portion (31 minutes later).

We live in a sea of brainwashing in our present times and those of us able to understand that are treading water while others drown or float on the censorship. Regardless of the views another may have, they don’t have to be yours, the ability to freely express ideas and have an open dialogue must be preserved. This is why I’m on voat.co because of this basic principle and why it should be protected . You don’t have to listen to me though I’m just another niggerfaggot chewing the cud with the other goats

"voat.co"

Anyone else see something odd with referring to Voat as "voat.co"? Looks scripted to me. Like this, only with JIDF or ADL as the cancerous authors of the script.

MadWorld ago

"voat.co"

Looks scripted to me.

Good catch! Looks like (((somebody))) forgot to define extra variable lols!

Crensch ago

Oh, hey! How about you put a nice little space there where you added more text in an edit, instead of stacking it on top and making it appear that I didn't address each of your points?

http://archive.is/wWyQU Here's a reminder of where you left off.

Cannonfodder ago

My fault I’m pretty stoned and posted before I finished my thought. All I’m saying is I can see where OP can consider SJW’s and Nazis are on the same coin because people are lemmings and will conform to an ideology easily and promote it without understanding it to conform others. This is an opinion. I have been on voat for a long time but I don’t post often here because I didn’t realize that was a requirement but I understand why that may seem suspicious.

Crensch ago

Nazis are on the same coin because people are lemmings and will conform to an ideology easily and promote it without understanding it to conform others.

... So all ideologies are the same because lemmings?

My fault I’m pretty stoned and posted before I finished my thought.

31 minute lag time is a lot. May want to call your doctor about that one.

This is an opinion. I have been on voat for a long time but I don’t post often here because I didn’t realize that was a requirement but I understand why that may seem suspicious.

It's not a requirement. I'm just not into believing in coincidences when things start looking funny.

You could be completely innocent here, and I could be wrong, but having such a similar posting frequency to OP, and him responding "we" really just seals the deal for me.

Cannonfodder ago

They can be the same because they provide a structure for a lemming to cling to. My brain is kinda shot from working all weekend, so your skepticism is appropriate because I’m just hashing out thoughts. I probably should not have jumped into such a topic but again I’m pretty baked. Have a good rest of your weekend

Crensch ago

They can be the same because they provide a structure for a lemming to cling to.

I posit the argument not worth bringing up as a way to compare the two if literally any ideology has the same flaw/similarity.

My brain is kinda shot from working all weekend, so your skepticism is appropriate because I’m just hashing out thoughts. I probably should not have jumped into such a topic but again I’m pretty baked. Have a good rest of your weekend

You too. Probably the best response you could give that would give me pause in thinking you're the same person.

Have a good rest of your weekend, either way.

Crensch ago

I kinda see it as holding any kind of ideology is essentially mind-control by yourself.

If you take that position, any internal framework is mind-control. What a stupid idea - process everything at every resolution every time, instead of taking mental shortcuts that work enough to make acceptable conclusions? Nobody has the time or mental resources for that.

Anyone can be persuaded to one idealogy or another which can be reinforced by the power of social conformity.

1) prove it

2) so?

It is easier on an individual’s mind and for the individual to trust pre-formed ideologies especially those established in a society than to have the fortitude to recognize the mental constructs in place for their mindcontrolling behavior and either accept them or form their own internal concepts of the world.

That's a lot of words to basically say that most people are lemmings. Did you have a point here? How does this explain SJWs and "Nazis" being equivalent, or Nazis wanting to control others' lives?

Since your comment was so suspiciously out of place, I took a quick look:

1st page of submissons: 1.7 years ago. 1st page of comments: 11 months ago. Looks a LOT like what I found about OP.

Scandinavian ago

Did you ever stop to think maybe the reason we stopped being active on Voat was because of people like you?

It's kind of hilarious. Your go-to is SJW'ing. Derailing discussion, ad hominem attacks.

Crensch ago

Did you ever stop to think maybe the reason we stopped being active on Voat was because of people like you?

"We".

http://archive.is/wWyQU

It's kind of hilarious. Your go-to is SJW'ing. Derailing discussion, ad hominem attacks.

Literally just outed you as both not belonging, and part of a group (or sock-puppet manufacturing-consensus) whose apparent intentions are to change this place with the authority of "This username made this subverse, so I don't have to support my positions, listen to me!".

Scandinavian ago

Haha, oh man.

Crensch, what are you doing on PV? You don't support any of the things PV was made to do: secure free discussion. Is it just a game of securing the right to yell kikeniggerfaggot for giggles?

Crensch ago

What aren't you free to discuss?

Does pointing out that you're likely a fraud somehow affect your ability to discuss things?

Scandinavian ago

I guess it's easier for you to accuse me of being a fraud than looking at yourself in the mirror.

The premise of the OP, which you tried being highschool cool about being 'not interested in', was exactly this premise: Voat isn't free as long as shills and brigaders roam free anyway.

Why are you so afraid to discuss this premise?

Crensch ago

Let me know when you want to explain "we", why you don't have to defend your position on SJW = "Nazis", your submission/comment activity being low and being similar to Cannonfodder, you expecting us not to notice any of the above, and what you aren't free to discuss.

Scandinavian ago

You let me know when you're ready for a real conversation.