I haven't found the comment in question, but here is an example of what happens when I handed everyone a whole vote farming sub of all the shills that were spamming up v/pizzagate at the time. Keep in mind that this was around the time that 2 contributing users, DarkMath and 2impendingdoom, were banned for "spam". I'm sure @Putitout wouldn't condone this bullshit.
Thanks for the link PuppetShow. First, mods can't ban people unless they break a subverse or Voatwide rule. Knowing an account is shilly doesn't mean we can ban it, although Falcon did do that on occasion when the sub was being flooded with shitposts that were being commented on by likely sockpuppets to get them higher on "Hot" view.
Second, I unbanned 2ImpendingDoom as soon as I was made aware that had happened. In the case of DarkMath, he became overly frustrated with the lack of public progress and blatant shilling and "blackpilled", posting multiple rule-breaking posts venting his spleen even though he knew better. He received brief warning ban and was unbanned within a day or two, and then started up again with posts we had to remove. He didn't give us much of a choice but to ban him. I have missed him ever since.
It was more their reaction with the "lulz" that made me and many others feel like these were SBBH alts. Kevdude did admit that crensch "stopped" SBBH from blowing up pizzagate, so it's not that crazy of an idea. I get that banning isn't really free speech, but when you have a bunch of alts that are doing nothing but vote farming in one sub and spamming up v/pizzagate, I'm pretty sure that breaks some Voat rules and nothing was done. It's curious.
You unbanning @2impendingdoom is appreciated, but unfortunately all this bullshit seems to have put him/her off too, not around much anymore. @DarkMath was obviously burnt out, we even had discussions about it. But, permanently banning someone who put a lot of work into this sub seems wrong when obvious shill accounts are aloud to contine to spam up the board and even vote farm.
I don't disagree with you, and I am totally willing to unban DarkMath if he hasn't been unbanned already, if he is willing to stay on topic in v/pizzagate.
when you have a bunch of alts that are doing nothing but vote farming in one sub and spamming up v/pizzagate, I'm pretty sure that breaks some Voat rules and nothing was done. It's curious.
I do my best to ban every alt that repeatedly breaks rules. Sometimes when they rotate accounts and wait weeks between shitposts, it's hard to realize they've exposed a demonstrable pattern. We have started a tracking thread in v/pizzagatemods to keep an eye on some of this behavior and let users know what the shills have been up to, since their posts usually get flushed out of sight. I am pretty sure Voat doesn't allow sites as large as ours to ban users for vote farming in other subs. It all comes down to a pattern of violating OUR subverse rules, or the Voat User Agreement. Helping mods document that goes a long way in combatting it, and you can do so in v/pizzagatemods, but most users don't want to reign shill wrath down on themselves.
I am totally willing to unban DarkMath if he hasn't been unbanned already, if he is willing to stay on topic
That's not what this is about, that should probably be a community vote or something. That's all I was really petitioning for back when that happened. If a long time contributing member is going to be banned, it should be the decision of the community.
I do my best to ban every alt that repeatedly breaks rules.
This isn't about you either. It was a little disappointing to be called a shill, but I'm not easily offended.
I am pretty sure Voat doesn't allow sites as large as ours to ban users for vote farming in other subs. It all comes down to a pattern of violating OUR subverse rules, or the Voat User Agreement.
That's what this is about.. I read a thread I believe @Putitout made (could have been @kevdude) and it was a giant argument about brigading. Vote farming was mentioned and Put was trying to stop it and banning subs if they were caught. I could be mixing up multiple threads. Anyways, I brought this incident to kevdude and Crensch, one of the owners of the sub, and was first ignored. https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/2042853/10080866
Then, when I decided to be a dick about to get their attention I was told to "eat a dick". https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/2048810/10104430 So.. Guess who can eat a dick? I don't like fuckers like that. Especially some of the bullshit they spread, they sound like CTR right before the election when they were framing everyone as Nazi. Even Pewdiepie, the gamer, got caught up in their bullshit.
I hear what you're saying. But Voat farming is something that has to be taken up with Putt and the larger Voat community by posting in v/ProtectVoat or v/whatever. That is where Crensch himself posts this type of problem. Posting it here is off topic and ends up being forum sliding.
The problem is exacerbated by the fact that we regularly have people who are NOT benevolent making the same type of posts and/or comments. For current examples, see this thread or this one. This effectively makes legit users look like sleeper-shills. When Crensch (who doesn't read most threads here regularly because he was meant to oversee and rein in mods, not the subverse itself) comes in and sees that, if linked evidence of mod mishandling isn't presented, he concludes it's shit-stirring and Crensches them. Sometimes there is a friendly fire incident. Other times, the user just doesn't understand, or perhaps doesn't agree with the rules or the interpretation of them.
You can argue that someone as blunt and willing to be offensive as Crensch shouldn't be overseeing a subverse populated with many users who are child rape survivors and don't handle attacks well. But Crensch also took v/pizzagate in order to teach its users how to survive Voat's rugged culture, which revels in offensive speech and verbal warfare. He has made multiple attempts to do that. And his association has helped us with Voat-at-large. The general population was not thrilled when 14,000 folks from Reddit aghast at the horrors of Pizzagate and Spirit Cooking flooded their shitposting and debating enclave with expectations of gentle language and sensitivity to feelings. From all the shill BS I've seen, and all the conversations I've had with the original mods of r/pizzagate, Crensch, kevdude and other "old goats", I firmly believe this huge culture clash was deliberately triggered by ShareBlue -- first driving us here, and then instigating and manipulating conflict. To me, it's a credit to Pizzagate researchers' commitment to the kids, and old Voaters' commitment to resisting Brock's attacks that has allowed us to prevail. It's quite astounding, really. But it has taken things like the ruleset (which now all removals require Voatwide), mod oversight, and a firm response to attackers to achieve it. In the end, we really are on the same side; we just have to keep trying to work together.
Posting it here is off topic and ends up being forum sliding.
Both of those were comments, not posts and they'll brigade you and belittle you in the other 2 threads to keep you from doing it again. Same thing happens in pizzagatemods. We aren't in v/pizzagate btw.
You can argue that someone as blunt and willing to be offensive as Crensch shouldn't be overseeing a subverse populated with many users who are child rape survivors and don't handle attacks well.
I'm arguing incompetence for ignoring vote farming and blatant shilling as an owner/admin. I don't really care if he wants to act like a useful idiot. I'm just pointing it out because if Putt really wants to expand, like I read, he should think about re-evaluating his PR department and get some admin that give a shit about the whole site and not just their clique.
I firmly believe this huge culture clash was deliberately triggered by ShareBlue
Me too, I just think it goes a little deeper than you do.
In the end, we really are on the same side; we just have to keep trying to work together.
We might be, I just don't believe all parties of this discussion are. Not after everything I've seen over the past year+.
view the rest of the comments →
ThePuppetShow ago
Good work figuring that shit out. This has to be site wide.. Maybe @kevdude will have some answers.
freshmeat ago
Kev wont help you. Ask the admin directly @PuttItOut
ThePuppetShow ago
You're right.. I just like to agitate the SBBH crew ever since I found out that they had a plot to destroy v/pizzagate.
Vindicator ago
Evidence, please. I have seen no such plot.
ThePuppetShow ago
I haven't found the comment in question, but here is an example of what happens when I handed everyone a whole vote farming sub of all the shills that were spamming up v/pizzagate at the time. Keep in mind that this was around the time that 2 contributing users, DarkMath and 2impendingdoom, were banned for "spam". I'm sure @Putitout wouldn't condone this bullshit.
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/2048810/10104430
Vindicator ago
Thanks for the link PuppetShow. First, mods can't ban people unless they break a subverse or Voatwide rule. Knowing an account is shilly doesn't mean we can ban it, although Falcon did do that on occasion when the sub was being flooded with shitposts that were being commented on by likely sockpuppets to get them higher on "Hot" view.
Second, I unbanned 2ImpendingDoom as soon as I was made aware that had happened. In the case of DarkMath, he became overly frustrated with the lack of public progress and blatant shilling and "blackpilled", posting multiple rule-breaking posts venting his spleen even though he knew better. He received brief warning ban and was unbanned within a day or two, and then started up again with posts we had to remove. He didn't give us much of a choice but to ban him. I have missed him ever since.
ThePuppetShow ago
It was more their reaction with the "lulz" that made me and many others feel like these were SBBH alts. Kevdude did admit that crensch "stopped" SBBH from blowing up pizzagate, so it's not that crazy of an idea. I get that banning isn't really free speech, but when you have a bunch of alts that are doing nothing but vote farming in one sub and spamming up v/pizzagate, I'm pretty sure that breaks some Voat rules and nothing was done. It's curious.
You unbanning @2impendingdoom is appreciated, but unfortunately all this bullshit seems to have put him/her off too, not around much anymore. @DarkMath was obviously burnt out, we even had discussions about it. But, permanently banning someone who put a lot of work into this sub seems wrong when obvious shill accounts are aloud to contine to spam up the board and even vote farm.
Just my 2¢
Vindicator ago
I don't disagree with you, and I am totally willing to unban DarkMath if he hasn't been unbanned already, if he is willing to stay on topic in v/pizzagate.
I do my best to ban every alt that repeatedly breaks rules. Sometimes when they rotate accounts and wait weeks between shitposts, it's hard to realize they've exposed a demonstrable pattern. We have started a tracking thread in v/pizzagatemods to keep an eye on some of this behavior and let users know what the shills have been up to, since their posts usually get flushed out of sight. I am pretty sure Voat doesn't allow sites as large as ours to ban users for vote farming in other subs. It all comes down to a pattern of violating OUR subverse rules, or the Voat User Agreement. Helping mods document that goes a long way in combatting it, and you can do so in v/pizzagatemods, but most users don't want to reign shill wrath down on themselves.
ThePuppetShow ago
That's not what this is about, that should probably be a community vote or something. That's all I was really petitioning for back when that happened. If a long time contributing member is going to be banned, it should be the decision of the community.
This isn't about you either. It was a little disappointing to be called a shill, but I'm not easily offended.
That's what this is about.. I read a thread I believe @Putitout made (could have been @kevdude) and it was a giant argument about brigading. Vote farming was mentioned and Put was trying to stop it and banning subs if they were caught. I could be mixing up multiple threads. Anyways, I brought this incident to kevdude and Crensch, one of the owners of the sub, and was first ignored. https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/2042853/10080866
Then, when I decided to be a dick about to get their attention I was told to "eat a dick". https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/2048810/10104430 So.. Guess who can eat a dick? I don't like fuckers like that. Especially some of the bullshit they spread, they sound like CTR right before the election when they were framing everyone as Nazi. Even Pewdiepie, the gamer, got caught up in their bullshit.
Vindicator ago
I hear what you're saying. But Voat farming is something that has to be taken up with Putt and the larger Voat community by posting in v/ProtectVoat or v/whatever. That is where Crensch himself posts this type of problem. Posting it here is off topic and ends up being forum sliding.
The problem is exacerbated by the fact that we regularly have people who are NOT benevolent making the same type of posts and/or comments. For current examples, see this thread or this one. This effectively makes legit users look like sleeper-shills. When Crensch (who doesn't read most threads here regularly because he was meant to oversee and rein in mods, not the subverse itself) comes in and sees that, if linked evidence of mod mishandling isn't presented, he concludes it's shit-stirring and Crensches them. Sometimes there is a friendly fire incident. Other times, the user just doesn't understand, or perhaps doesn't agree with the rules or the interpretation of them.
You can argue that someone as blunt and willing to be offensive as Crensch shouldn't be overseeing a subverse populated with many users who are child rape survivors and don't handle attacks well. But Crensch also took v/pizzagate in order to teach its users how to survive Voat's rugged culture, which revels in offensive speech and verbal warfare. He has made multiple attempts to do that. And his association has helped us with Voat-at-large. The general population was not thrilled when 14,000 folks from Reddit aghast at the horrors of Pizzagate and Spirit Cooking flooded their shitposting and debating enclave with expectations of gentle language and sensitivity to feelings. From all the shill BS I've seen, and all the conversations I've had with the original mods of r/pizzagate, Crensch, kevdude and other "old goats", I firmly believe this huge culture clash was deliberately triggered by ShareBlue -- first driving us here, and then instigating and manipulating conflict. To me, it's a credit to Pizzagate researchers' commitment to the kids, and old Voaters' commitment to resisting Brock's attacks that has allowed us to prevail. It's quite astounding, really. But it has taken things like the ruleset (which now all removals require Voatwide), mod oversight, and a firm response to attackers to achieve it. In the end, we really are on the same side; we just have to keep trying to work together.
ThePuppetShow ago
Both of those were comments, not posts and they'll brigade you and belittle you in the other 2 threads to keep you from doing it again. Same thing happens in pizzagatemods. We aren't in v/pizzagate btw.
I'm arguing incompetence for ignoring vote farming and blatant shilling as an owner/admin. I don't really care if he wants to act like a useful idiot. I'm just pointing it out because if Putt really wants to expand, like I read, he should think about re-evaluating his PR department and get some admin that give a shit about the whole site and not just their clique.
Me too, I just think it goes a little deeper than you do.
We might be, I just don't believe all parties of this discussion are. Not after everything I've seen over the past year+.