Main stream media claims this, based on... which investigations? Well, the investigation is exactly what we are demanding and now, according to them, it seems that one has already taken place. So where is it? And what were the results?
Let's have a peek from the point of view of the other side. MSM seems to base their claim mainly on two other claims: That AJ apologized, and that EMW pledged guilty. So this is their study? This debunks it all?
On the other hand, we claim that AJ was tricked/forced to do that or that he's simply fraud, and that EMW was a hired/forced actor on a false-flag attack. On AJ we have his whole history of publishing and additionally his latest claim (after apologizing) that the CPP was a false-flag in the first place, cover put up by NSA to distrack the investigation of pedogate. On EMW, we have a list of supporting theories.
Looking VERY OBJECTIVELY, our claims are about 70-80% stronger than what MSM ever had. Based on this... MSM's are debunking themselves! The fact that MSM has not taken ANY of our claims under investigation, or searched for any objective investigation on any of those, makes this 100% clear.
What is so great is that by doing like this, MSM is actually... proving pedogate!
(and we don't need to trust neither AJ nor EMW flags/frauds to see that. We only need to showcase the level of journalism.)
view the rest of the comments →
AreWeSure ago
It's more that Pizzagate has never come close to proving a single thing.
At its core pizzagate makes a claim that John Podesta used coded language in his emails to hide pedophilia which then became human trafficking which then became Satanic ritual abuse which then became Cannibalism and so on and so on. (Have you heard about the pig farms?) Then people started looping in every single other case they could find and claiming it's a single ring and is part of an elite conspiracy going back generations.
None of this makes any sense to someone who doesn't already hate Hillary Clinton AND have deeply held beliefs in preexisting elite conspiracies.
You don't have to do anything to debunk it. The term I used is Prebunked.
People started making outrageous claims or outright lies about the emails and these quickly became accepted as fact. For example, you make the claim EMW was a hired actor. Surely you know, there's no proof of that correct? It's a story pizzagaters have told themselves and the deeply believe it.......see preexisting conspiracy theories above.....but the evidence they have is tissue paper thin. Folks think they can make a bunch of connections of tissue paper thin pieces of evidence and built a 100 grade battleship chain out of tissue. But upon the slightest examination the whole thing falls apart.
Pizzagaters have shown absolutely zero instances of coded messages in Joh Podesta emails. Some meanings are unknown. Some of the code highlighted by pizzagaters is demonstrably false.
If you want to point to any code, I'll give my thoughts.
We are all prone to confirmation bias and conspiratorial thinking and making more of random coincidence than we should. It's how the human brain works. You need to be on guard and practice checking your thinking if you don't want to fall for a false story you are telling yourself, not the real story. Our brains love storytelling and when we see gaps or ambiguity, we can creative narrative links that seems to make sense and seem to hold everything together, but we are really just kidding ourselves.
Basically if are not a person prone to the confirmation biases inherent in the pizzagate origin story, the whole thing sounds ridiculous.
EDIT: I don't get to post many comments so, I just keep editing this post.
Note: Please understand I'm not going to respond to a Gish Gallop of evidence. I'm not interested how long a chain you made. I would like to go back to the very beginning to take individual links from the emails and see if the pizzagate assertions about them amount to anything. Another issue with this is folks determined to make Podesta look bad will be ultra-literal in reading of evidence. To someone who doesn't have that confirmation bias, basic reading comprehension would tell you this is not being used literally.
EDIT: @Antiracist2
Let me put it this way? Have you ever owned a red bandana? Every had it your back pocket? Does that you mean you advertising your sexual preferences? I certainly have owned red bandanas. I may have even worn them in back pocket. And yet I did completely unaware of its meaning to a small subculture.
EDIT @toodrunktofuck Congrats on acknowledging this is a theory based on circumstantial evidence. Too few people acknowledge that. Despite that people refer to Clinton, Podesta, Alefantis, et al definitely as child molesters, criminals, traffickers etc. This is what I think the press refers to when they said debunked.
EDIT @anonOpenPress
There's zero evidence EMW did not act out of his own volition. Zero evidence anyone hired him. The story that he was a paid actor started almost immediately based on preexisting conspiratorial beliefs. Government run false-flags are so commonly discussed as to be a cliche. It's template you can put on any event, a template you can use without a single bit of evidence EMW chose to do what he did.
For many people this is also about their Anti-Mason or Anti Illuminati or anti-NWO anti-government or anti-MSM media beliefs. The idea of dropping the nonsense with the weak evidence and focusing energy on genuine human trafficking that is out there is anathema to them. It would threaten their beliefs. If you gave them the chance to actually help children, but they had to recognize the truth, that they were mislead about Podesta or Alefantis, they would never take it. Helping children simply wouldn't be enough for them.
I don't. You don't. But so what? This proves absolutely nothing. Perhaps Tony Podesta does talk that way. You have no baseline for comparison. You have no clue how he speaks. FBI investigators are trained that when you interview someone and their knees are shaking and they can't look you in the eye that DOES NOT prove deceptive behavior. Because you have to first find out how the person regularly behaves. They are trained to ask a series of neutral questions before any accusatory questions and notice changes in behavior. Because you as an outsider find something strange doesn't equal this is coded talk. The love to get a pizza for an hour thing has never bothered me at all because John Podesta has a crammed schedule. I've always read this as equivalent, "can you get away for an hour to grab lunch?" And pizza is a meal you can do in an hour.
Do you know the actual story about that? It's a completely appropriate what Podesta says and a very human response. Frankly, this to me is a test if you are approaching this story rationally. The two women in the photo are Euna Lee and Laura Ling, reporters working a story about North Korean defectors. They were working on the Chinese side of the border. They got a tip from a source that he could give them a scoop. In reality, he was double-crossing them to North Korea. He convinced them to go with him across the border to North Korea. Once they did they were arrested. The girl in the photo is Euna Lee's daughter. They had just been released from 140 days of captivity in a North Korean prison. I believe that photo was the first time the two reporters got together back in the US. They were home, free and eating pizza with their family. I ask you, person to person, does it get any better than that? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_imprisonment_of_American_journalists_by_North_Korea http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/freed-journalists-laura-ling-euna-lee-call-captivity-n-korea-nightmare-article-1.395031
Are_we_sure ago
@libertyforhumanity
I completely disagree with that. The folks who I learned about pizzagate from were absolutely gleeful about it mainly due to political reasons. Also think of all the folks on here who want their worldview validated who want people to be "redpilled."
I don't. Like I said this is from outside the Podesta emails. Does he mention Silsby? Maybe he does. However, I have seen zero evidence that Hillary Clinton knew who she was prior to her being arrested. I never saw her as a sex trafficker/organ seller and still don't. I've always viewed Silsby as Christian Missionary wacko type.
The sketches are totally weird. However, the police say BOTH sketches are supposed to be the same man a man between 20 and 40 years old. They have said that on the day the sketches came out.
Also both of these are very common features of conspiratorial thinking called anomaly hunting. It's focusing on the weird details at the expense of the whole. If you want to ignore the fact that neither John nor Tony Podesta could be confused for being 20 years old at the time of her kidnapping, this may become more significant for you.
anonOpenPress ago
As you mentioned Clinton haters, is clear enough code for you? https://newrepublic.com/article/120269/contractors-violate-us-zero-tolerance-policy-human-trafficking (for me this is not about politics, it's about children)
And since you asked...
...just a thought, why I'm doing this? You're obviously looking for factual PROOF, so please, start the background study and help us (and the kids)
Antiracist2 ago
But it's not like we picked any random symbol in the emails and connected it to any matching random symbol in reality. Like a spiral or a triangle here or there. It's that the symbol that was picked was used in coded language, pizza, and a pizza place was visited by Hilary and has an owner who seems to have undue power and owns a kids' clothing store.
Plus there was that spirit cooking stuff, and when you then look at Podesta's collected art and the type of motifs that CCP had, it all meshes together.
@SarMegahhikkitha @Bojangles @eagleshigh
dougG ago
What coded symbols were in the emails ?
clowntrash ago
AreWeSure, your previous posts (especially the ones with an extreme amount of negative votes) make me wonder why you're on here. You speculate everything which is fine but I just went through almost all of your previous comments and you rarely ever(if at all cause I didn't read all of them) believe pizzagate to be true. With a name like that and all of these negative comments with poor votes...why are you here? Also...
If you're discussing pizzagate not having any decent proof...Here's why Hillary, Podesta and Alefantis are all potentially involved in something pure evil.
Alefantis is great friends with Michael Maccoby whose son is a director of friends of the orphans, the charity Laura Silsby was given children from(for child trafficking). Max Maccoby, director of friends of the orphans, also represented James alefantis and David Brock for a $850,000 blackmail case (I'll link with all the info). Alefantis had several strange photos of children on his Instagram(there's more to the story than just this), he's close friends with the Podesta brother (the brothers who love child torture and morbid art so much that they put it up in their homes), hosts private political party's, has rock bands that almost blatantly promote pedophilia play at some of these private events. Heck, even former D.C. Councilman Frank Winstead accused Alefantis of this in 2008. He's a small piece in a giant ring of potential pedophiles.
Prove this info wrong and I'll leave you be.
Oh and here. https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1523591
Also...you know you're on to something when bots start appearing with the same messages. https://twitter.com/zeeeffgee/status/808843093965410304 https://twitter.com/momeetsaisha/status/810230488757633025 Isn't it weird how people keep making accounts with your name in different variants posting the same photo and message?
This has happened in other governments. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PBiwim8X2J0
And since Podesta received strange emails such as https://twitter.com/_makada_/status/805656957109567489
And this same lady that offered her children also offered their services on this website https://twitter.com/franseenwrites/status/832396005706461184
https://archive.is/JGhR6
Podesta's brother, Tony Podesta(hillarys potential Secretary of State brother and close ally)also mentions a torture room in a Wikileaks email. https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/56492 They both own art of children being tortured and rape. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NHQObjFyJzM
And how are Podesta and Alefantis tied together in this Pizzagate discussion? The New York Times calls them friends. Both own art containing pedophilia, murder and cannibalism. Alefantis Instagram photos are riddled with images of children, jokes of murder and selling kids. He even posted an image of a guy with a baby calling him a chicken lover. http://www.counter-currents.com/2016/12/pizzagate/ http://www.definition-of.com/chicken%20lover
Here's some I was talking about https://archive.fo/5UecO http://archive.is/hXYje http://m.imgur.com/a/txnm3
Oh and the chicken lover with the kid with the "nugget"...is actually a carrot so you don't know what you're even talking about http://archive.is/2XUmH
Here's Alefantis being called out in 2008 http://archive.is/ezdQE
Here's people posting about comet ping pong https://archive.is/FMLbx https://archive.fo/mKH6M
James Alefantis' sister, Susan Alefantis wrote a letter in support of a teacher who was convicted of molesting 5 girls:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/835178/kloman-letter-writers.pdf
Here is an article on the abuser: https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/potomac-school-investigation-uncovers-more-alleged-abuse/2014/06/30/57abfa0e-0072-11e4-8fd0-3a663dfa68ac_story.html
Here's a lot more links https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiLeaks/comments/5bsxv4/weird_pizza_in_washington/
dougG ago
"Torture room" is obviously his office during a busy day and having a pool party for kids is only as sick as your mind makes it, sorry, but kids to old people are entertaining...
clowntrash ago
Obviously? I missed the part where this was explained further as just being in the office... You're making assumptions just as much as the rest but yet you claim yours as fact. All we want is a proper investigation into these people. If nothings there then I would be able to sleep easier knowing children aren't being harmed like this...but every time something pizzagate related comes out or we find something, links get deleted, newspaper archives disappear, images get removed from sites, shootings happen (after the street camera gets moved a day prior) and a computer gets shot and removed. Too many strange things have happened and you coming on here and spending your time downplaying it only makes me further suspicious as to what your intentions are. But while you're at it, will you debunk the rest of my post instead of cherry picking...but this time, use links and proof. First things first, discuss the chicken lovers hashtag (it's obviously bright orange and possibly a carrot in the baby's mouth so don't say it's chicken)
dougG ago
I am not trying to debunk pizza/pedo gate rather just debunk the things that don't make sense/are illogical so the majority of the investigative focus can be narrowed from the immense black hole of info/disinformation
clowntrash ago
Do you believe that pizzagate is real and that politicians are human trafficking?
dougG ago
I absolutely do but not in some of the absurd scenarios and contexts that wishwashed together on here.....
clowntrash ago
Ok I was just making sure! Totally agree. I would like to remain as factual as possible.