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19319482? ago

The finality of life and death finally dawned on me a few years ago at the ripe age of 24, w a little bit of help after trying the spirit molecule DMT... I was a bit stoned, and it hit me like a strike of lightning, “My God..... Jesus Christ.....” the words were ELECTRIFIED within me, it occurred to me, how strange the power these names hold. They aren’t just two words, they are conscious entities, the ability to even be here and say or think these two words is incredible.

19320971? ago

I've never done DMT, but I have a weird story. I had my picture taken in front of a building when I was 16, just a very very random building. 2 years later I happened to be reading Rick Straussman's book "DMT: The Spirit Molecule," and as I was doing some research about the book etc. I came to find that his office was the very building that I had my picture taken in front of 2 years prior. Kind of a freaky coincidence for me.

19322023? ago

A sign. Try some. There’s no way God means for us to ignore DMT.

19322525? ago

Psychedelic drugs are certainly a means to break through to the spiritual realm. I don’t recommend using them for this end, however, as those boundaries were put in place for a reason.

19323286? ago

Who put those boundaries in place and for what reason?

19325547? ago

IMO God put them in place, as the spiritual realm here on earth is infested with all kinds of evil beings, most notable being demons (the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim). I suspect by using illicit drugs (and even large quantities of alcohol) that we are opening ourselves up to being influenced/controlled by these beings.

19330415? ago

Man's laws make those boundaries, not God.

19331652? ago

No, the Bible warns against “sorceries”, which is related to drug usage (examine the Greek). But hey it’s your life, do whatever you want with it. I’ve been around long enough that my kids are probably older than half the people on VOAT, but what do I know? I’ve witnessed people’s lives absolutely destroyed by drugs or alcohol. It has profoundly affected me and my family so much that I can no longer endorse their use. And maybe some people are not chasing a high, but just an experience. But that’s all it is, and that’s all it will ever be - an experience. It’s a juvenile way to pursue “spirituality”, because it really doesn’t impart any wisdom. Look at some of the people who have been into psychedelics for decades. Do you want to be like that? How about John McAfee (who endorses DMT), do you want to be like him? Frankly the guy is a head case. And honestly, most of the people who mess with this stuff have no idea what doors they are opening. If they did they would be terrified. Look, if you want to import some sort of meaning to your life, find something else besides a drug experience. Get married and raise children. Go climb Mount Everest. Donate your time at the local boys and girls club. Drugs will seduce you. They always do. The biggest lie is that “you got this.” But you don’t. In the end they will adversely affect your life, whether that is 50 hours from now or 50 years from now.

But hey, what do I know?

19346486? ago

No, the Bible warns against “sorceries”, which is related to drug usage (examine the Greek).

What drugs does this include? Beer? Coffee?

I’ve witnessed people’s lives absolutely destroyed by drugs or alcohol. It has profoundly affected me and my family so much that I can no longer endorse their use

How many people have you witnessed ruin their lives from DMT or magic mushrooms?

If that number is greater than 0, I will know you are lying.

Let us not pretend that all "drugs" are exactly the same, anon.

How about John McAfee (who endorses DMT), do you want to be like him?

John McAfee has done a lot more than DMT. You might have a point if DMT were the only drug he had ever used.

And honestly, most of the people who mess with this stuff have no idea what doors they are opening. If they did they would be terrified

Experienced DMT user here. Please enlighten me, anon.

Look, if you want to import some sort of meaning to your life, find something else besides a drug experience. Get married and raise children

DMT caused me to stop neglecting my own wife and children in pursuit of the almighty dollar, and caused me to make changes in my life that brought me closer to them. If not for that drug, I'd be at my desk right now instead of watching them water our garden with water from our rain cistern.

Drugs will seduce you. They always do.

It's been 3+ years since my last DMT trip. I possess enough to get an auditorium high off their rocks, and have opportunity galore, but I haven't had the slightest desire to use it in all that time.

How does this track with your assertion that "drugs will seduce you. they always do", anon?

But hey, what do I know?

Indeed.

19331760? ago

Nicely said.

19326544? ago

If God put them in place he’d have warned us off them.

Which bible verse(s) prohibit moderate use of “illicit” drugs (illicit in quotes because it is only illicit in the eyes of certain men who may or may not mean you well)?

19334071? ago

God is the real deal. Drugs are drugs. You don't have to do drugs to get to the same realization, one is true and the other may cause you to miss the truth.

19346087? ago

But I did not say you "have" to do drugs to come to any realization. God put far too much in this world for anyone to do it all. My message is not that everyone should do DMT but, rather, that there is no way God intended for DMT to be off limits.

"Drugs are drugs" is grossly oversimplified. Some drugs cure cancer, like THC. Some drugs enhance your spiritual side, like DMT. Some drugs are ultra addictive, like opiates, while others are difficult or impossible to abuse, like THC and DMT.

You are free to imbibe in any of the above, or not. But I don't believe you have a case if you're trying to say God intended for all of us to steer clear of these things in all cases.

19366156? ago

"Drugs are drugs" is grossly oversimplified.

I meant that within the context of spiritual pursuit, and in particular DMT. I agree with you that drugs medicinally and in some cases recreationally or stress relief, treating illness etc. aren't prohibited. Biblically wine is encouraged in moderate amounts within certain situations.

However, in the Christian faith, there's a call to come together and 'reason' with God, something one doesn't do when experiencing hallucinations. Christian tradition, while replete with spiritual experiences of saints, spiritual mystics, healers, prophets, even the wise 'fools' who live outside the mainstream and seem crazy, the monastics, there are so many facets of Christian spiritual life, yet visions and such are not recommended to be pursued in of themselves because without the foundation of guidance within the Christian tradition (speaking of Orthodox Christians here) there's just a lot of potentially very serious downsides. That being said, many people find their way to the Church via various experiences along the way within their life. And they are generally truth seekers with a love for truth, or at least a sense of valuing truth above so much else that devalues it.

19376997? ago

However, in the Christian faith, there's a call to come together and 'reason' with God, something one doesn't do when experiencing hallucinations

I disagree. It might not be the only way to come together and reason with God, but it is one way IMO. The insights delivered unto me during my DMT trips were the exact things I needed to stop being depressed and disconnected from my family and start living my life productively and in harmony with my family. It feels like DMT allows you to set aside all the profanity and anger in your life, and approach the crystal clear and exactly accurate logic and reasoning of God honestly.

If anyone had told me to do the things that DMT told me to do, before I'd ever taken DMT, I would have dismissed that evidence out of hand. I had a high powered, high paying job, my name on a building, fast luxury cars, and a massive yearly property tax bill on my house. I thought I was on top of the world, and you would have wanted me to grow fucking chickens??

So tell me, in which state do you think I was more able to come together and "reason" with God?

If you see my point, you should then ask yourself: who benefits from preventing you from communing with God in the same way I have? Who benefits from keeping you enslaved to money and cruelty?

there are so many facets of Christian spiritual life, yet visions and such are not recommended to be pursued in of themselves because without the foundation of guidance within the Christian tradition (speaking of Orthodox Christians here) there's just a lot of potentially very serious downsides

Your point appears to distill down to "don't take that path because it's too risky." To live is to risk it all, fren. I'm glad I took the hard path, it changed my life and I thank God for it every day.

19378146? ago

I thought I was on top of the world, and you would have wanted me to grow fucking chickens??

Glad to see the anger thing worked out for you /s.

I'm glad I took the hard path,

not sure what you mean by that, doing DMT doesn't sound like the hard path, but I haven't taken it so I can't say.

I've heard people worship a female deity they believe is behind the profound spiritual insights they claim to experience from DMT.

If anyone had told me to do the things that DMT told me to do

Glad it worked out for you to no longer be enslaved to money and cruelty. That is a positive thing. I'm not claiming to know what it is to walk in your shoes, I was giving my opinion based from Christian tradition and my own experiences.

19391903? ago

Glad to see the anger thing worked out for you /s.

I am not angry now. I was speaking in what would have been my voice at that time and mental state.

not sure what you mean by that, doing DMT doesn't sound like the hard path, but I haven't taken it so I can't say.

My calling DMT "the hard path" is in response to this, which I presume was you:

there are so many facets of Christian spiritual life, yet visions and such are not recommended to be pursued in of themselves because without the foundation of guidance within the Christian tradition (speaking of Orthodox Christians here) there's just a lot of potentially very serious downsides

As I understood the above paragraph, you were saying that DMT is just too risky. My response was, if that is the case, I'm glad I took the hard path. It was worth the risk.

I've heard people worship a female deity they believe is behind the profound spiritual insights they claim to experience from DMT.

We've come a long way from "I have many friends who ruined their lives abusing DMT."

We have already established that DMT isn't to be trifled with. If you go into it the wrong way (or probably more importantly, with the wrong people), you may come out of without having fully appreciated what happened to you.

Glad it worked out for you to no longer be enslaved to money and cruelty. That is a positive thing. I'm not claiming to know what it is to walk in your shoes, I was giving my opinion based from Christian tradition and my own experiences.

I appreciate your input. I don't claim to be within the doctrine of traditional Christian thought. My only position is that I see no basis for thinking God forbids us from taking DMT. Some people get their message from God in the form of the virgin Mary appearing on burnt toast or whatever, I got mine from that amazing drug.

19327191? ago

I suggest a study involving the words “sorcery” and “sorceries” as they are used in the Bible. The Greek words are related to drug usage. Also, if you rely on feelings and emotions to guide you on your journey here on earth, you will most certainly be deceived.

19346326? ago

Are they also related to drinking alcohol? Coffee?

If not, where is the distinction?

19328639? ago

exactly, most psychedelics reprogram your mind, but without a proper set of instructions and preparation, during this process, results in many false-epiphanies that "feel" incredibly profound.

19346378? ago

Can you give some examples of false epiphanies derived from DMT?

One major epiphany that came to me on DMT was that I was too focused on wealth, at the expense of my children and wife. We downsized our living arrangements, began to grow our own food more, took less work and, as a result, became much closer with them and vice versa.

Another was that there is too much cruelty in my life. I opted out of factory torture meet, bought some chickens (who live off of my food scraps and bugs around my property), and eat their eggs. The chickens are entirely free to act out their natural behaviours, and I get all the complete protein I need, free of cruelty.

These epiphanies felt profound when I was high off my ass on DMT, and still feel profound now, though I'm 3+ years off of it. Taking that drug a few times changed the entire course of my life, in fact. Now you are telling me they were false epiphanies?

Nice to see you again, agent smith. You always appear right when you are needed. Now you tell me, who has been programmed?

19349338? ago

Haha, "Agent Smith." haha.

I'm glad you had solid epiphanies and that your life is improved even years after as a result, but i have a lot of stories of friends who abused DMT and ended up thinking all kinds of false-nonsense is true.

Most people end up taking psychedelic drugs in a party setting, when they are also intoxicated with alcohol, when it comes time for their mind to put itself back together in the latter half of the trip, they are drunk, and unable to sort themselves out, the result is catastrophe.....

19354134? ago

How did your friends abuse DMT, anon?

The refractory period is several days. One would need to take progressively more and more each time just to get the same high. That, coupled with the fact that it is not addictive physiologically or mentally makes it unusually difficult to abuse.

People who take DMT under the circumstances you describe tend to never take it again. It’s very uncomfortable and frightening for very little payoff as a party drug.

What kinds of false nonsense did your friends come to believe, anon?

19365080? ago

Smoking dmt multiple times a day for months on end, they thought they were seeing the "aliens that created us."

19365539? ago

Does the existence of alcoholics mean none of us should drink?

While I think the odds of ending up like your friend after dabbling in DMT are very low indeed, I should add that I’ve not said people should take DMT with wild abandon and no regard for potential consequences.

No matter what you do, you should have your head about you while (or at least before) you do it.