I've been watching some UFO films of late, out of general interest. Without getting into what I, or you, believe...would someone with some experience care to comment for me? I have questions...
In these times of excellent photo resolution, why is *everything* so blurry, never mind what is purported to be photoshopped out? Surely distance and camera resolution are not this much of a problem? Or do you state that we are being shown purposely blurred stuff?
Although there are differences between the various videos, there seems to be a fairly common 'library' of images. I presume everyone who makes a new video is cutting and pasting to suit their current statement. Are they borrowing from each other, or is there a central 'bank' of films? I'm thinking, for instance, of the large spaceship that was purported to be the focus of Apollo 20 mission, and the pictures/videos of the pilot with those oddly clumsy gimmicks pasted on her face? Likewise those pictures of alien cities on the moon, which to me look a lot like concept art from sci-fi novels of the '60s, which was my era. (I'm not poo-pooing; just saying. I have an open mind at the moment. Please enlighten me.)
There's a lot of really ham-fisted production out there. Needlessly dramatic music that all but drowns the narrator, regional accents (I suppose there's no help for that, but it doesn't make for authority), dumb sci-fi graphics at beginning and end that are better suited to toy advertising...you know, if this really is a serious discussion, I don't understand why all this infantile approach appeals to anybody.
And also with that, there is a proportion of the videos I see that are narrated by what can only be described as goofballs, people who you think must be high on something. False jocularity, dumb vocal dynamics that detract from their points, it's so damn irritating! It's not that I want everybody to have a grave, uninflected, unemotional voice. I get it that some people are quite excited by stuff they've found, like the fellow who spotted something bouncing across the moon with his home equipment, and then couldn't get an answer from NASA even months later. But I don't think the subject is improved by redneck foolishness. So why do it? Is this just internet freedom at work, and the people who care about this stuff really are goofy? Or would you like me to know that there's nothing to see, nothing to know, just move along to something that makes sense, that's right....
Sorry, bit of a rant. But I sincerely ask you, intelligent science person. What's up with this blurriness, both photographic and in communication?
threesevens ago
The UFO conspiracy environment is corrupted with a lot of disinformation and discrediting tactics. There's a lot of BS to sift through.
zen_music ago
Very true. I read a bunch of stuff last night, now this morning I'm sitting here thinking: the whole thing about UFOs and aliens is just a part of this experience. By far more important is the revelation that the lies and crime and suborning and viciousness and unimaginable cruelty all go so very much deeper than I've ever thought about. That's the issue now. I'll get back to UFOs, or rather take in what I can along the way, but I got to tell you, I'm baffled this morning about where you set out to understand, never mind correct, this incredibly ugly human condition where lies and more lies are, most likely, the object of a lot of glee and wild craziness among the group that creates it.
Clearly I am an innocent lamb. Led a pretty sheltered life, I admit it. It's so disappointing. I remember reading in a book by Scott Peck years ago, "People Of The Lie", that most of us are so conditioned away from believing the worst of others, that when we encounter something truly evil we have no mental framework with which to perceive it! And so, end up not even comprehending what we're looking at. I feel that way now. My thanks to these more experienced souls who have given me such a poor night's rest; I do thank you. I still have no idea what I might do with this information, but at least I'm not as asleep as I was yesterday. That has to count for something, right?
Thanks again. I'm not looking forward to this course of study.
threesevens ago
Really this kind of disinformation awareness applies to almost any kind of study, whether history or occult or conspiracy. You always have to be aware of those that are there to lead you in the wrong direction through diversionary tactics or outright lies. I would strongly suggest the work of Mark Passio, who has been my guide and mentor. He has a podcast which if you listen to from the first one will give you a broad and deep knowledge base with which to work from. You might want to start here with his Natural Law Seminar. Congratulations on taking the first steps of this journey, you will be rewarded for your work with greater awareness and wisdom about our world.
zen_music ago
I smile at your assumption of my youth; haha, thanks! I think... but yeah, I am uninformed, or more accurately, ignorant. I'll look up your suggestions. "big-lies" is a copy layout nightmare...
zen_music ago
I've had a few experiences that I'd be unwilling to repeat; makes me a little elevated to have even asked this question. But I very much appreciate these sources. Thanks.
zyxzevn ago
I have studied the UFO phenomenon for quite some time, speaking with witnesses, investigating sightings. I also investigated other stuff. Investigating it yourself is the only way you can get the truth about it.
My hypothesis is that there are many outer-dimensional beings, outside our common 3D physical world. See Jacques Vallee. It fits with almost all serious witness accounts and evidence that I have met so far.
The photographs will become blurry due to the dimensions overlapping.
They appear at certain places because these places are more open to other dimensions.
The witnesses often have more connection to other dimensions, and often have spiritual capabilities.
The best UFO evidence often show light-balls that move in a weird way and can get close to physical objects. The foo-fightser, Hessdalen and most mexican sightings are in this category.
Other sightings, including abductions have a more Oz-effect on them. That may indicate that reality is somehow broken.
There is also interesting research into abductions and cow-mutulations.
Linda Molton Howle has good information about it. She has a lot of interesting information about this. The idea that she presents is very scary: both aliens and military are actively abducting and manipulating people for different agendas. From my hypothesis, this would only be possible on certain places and under certain circumstances (and possibly with certain people).
There certainly is an involvement of the military in this matter. There are many ufo-sightings that were later followed by military actions in some way. They certainly have some information that the are not sharing. They seem to use the UFO phenomenon in many ways:
1) Continuous declarations of that they are fake, as if they are not taken seriously in whatever way.
2) Sightings are send to a central base, were they are kept secret.
3) Planting of hoaxes.
4) Planting of fake explanations (U2/Mongul anyone?).
5) Hiding of extraordinary technology (Aurora/pulse-engine).
Anyone who has seen the published documents, will have spotted the many black lines involved in these cases. There is 100% proof of that they are hiding something. Since some sightings are directly related to nukes, these sightings should be considered very important.
The disclosure project goes a lot deeper. It tries to expose many of the military operations on the UFO subject. My own opinion is that many of these people were informed with false information, so that their interesting findings would be easy to dismiss.
The first atomic bomb has been kept totally secret for a long time, by using small cells of specialized people that each know nothing about the subject. You can that a similar structure is used in the UFO phenomenon.
Besides the military there is also a very active community that is attacking everything related to UFOs and aliens. Often they stage hoaxes too.
That does not mean that there are no hoaxes. There are many youtube-channels out there that just claim every bird or rocket launch to be a UFO. Some other channels show that certain UFOs are CGI-hoaxes or caused by reflections in the sky. But they often generalize that this means that everything is a hoax.
And not everything UFO is aliens either. And, as I witnessed myself, there is far more than our society accepts.
zen_music ago
Not to disagree, but at the moment I'm more into 'stuff' and why I can't get a good look at it... the whole topic of whether or not things exist is a background investigation to my current puzzlement that what's available is so fumblefooted. But hey, what do I know? Nothing.
xeemee ago
if your root question is whether we are/have been visited by our "off-world brothers" as i call them, then i don't think i could expand a hell of a lot more than what @deerhoof_fan says - there is simply no doubt
however, the problem is that there is a lot of disinformation out there - for instance, if i saw a UFO today, my first ? would be; is it ours, or theirs?
there are plenty of images that are not blurry - look into the Billy Meier case for example - it is probably one of the most extensively documented cases there is, spanning many years, with many corroborating witnesses
Steven Greer is a long-time researcher - his work has influenced the ET/UFO community heavily - one of the projects he runs is CSETI (Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence) - there are chapters all over the world and their goal is to make a peaceful connection with ET's - there's lots of video and images in their archives
if you have not seen Greer's presentation that he gave in 2001 (it was overshadowed by 9-11) at the National Press Club in DC, i highly recommend watching it
most importantly - and this is KEY to understanding why the matter has been so covered up - is the simple, logical fact that "they" are not using fossil-based fuels or rockets to get here - now imagine the consequences that 'big oil' would have to face if this technology were released to the public - this would - not 'could' - lead to a complete transformation of society
in the long run, i'm not exactly sure what to make of Greer, but there can be no doubt that a) we have been visited and b) they ain't burnin' gasoline - they must be "traveling" at "speeds" that are faster than light - you'll understand why i put those words in quotes if you study Greer's work ... or quantum physics
you'll also find a lot of info in the Project Camelot whistle-blower archive - i highly suggest all videos with Bob Dean
zen_music ago
Thanks for your considered reply. I'll happily check the sources you quote. You ask about my root question, whether we are/have been visited, and it's more that I've begun to think, "I should check this out", only to find the file of information rather smaller than I expected and kind of smudged. And I'm thinking, "There's been so much effort put into this...why aren't the results a little more coherent?"
Regarding the 'big oil' reference, that's understandable- if we've learned anything at all lately, it's that money talks- but I'd have thought the offworlders themselves wouldn't mind clearing things up a bit. Unless they're thinking of us in the way we think of seeing a few ants around the house, wondering if there's a nest somewhere we'll have to do something about. Off to click blue lines...
xeemee ago
we're getting into theories here, not facts, but the presiding belief among the ET community is that they have a "non interference" policy which, when you consider the nuclear minute-man silo interventions where multiple military personal have testified (watch the National Press Club event i linked to) that UFO interfered with their ability to launch, does not seem entirely accurate - make of it what you will, but, to put it another way, don't expect them to land on the whitehouse lawn - we have to solve our own problems, especially if we want to be free - expecting someone else to intervene teaches us nothing, i think you might agree
it is a VERY common question though - study the works others and myself linked to - you'll quickly get the picture
also check these out...
Dr. Steven Greer - Nov. 21, 2015 - How the Secret Government Works: The Most Explosive Expose
Sirius Disclosure - large archive of talks by Greer
zen_music ago
I will, thank you. Fascinating listening to Steven Greer; though I won't decide for some time yet, I must say his statements seem practical and likely. Especially where he suggests that he is still alive because of a standoff between power-groups. If I were he, I would be concerned for my family. If roadside police can be vicious, how black is a black-op heart?
Edit to add: I see what you mean about a non-interference policy. On the other hand, any student of humans would quickly learn that it's dumb to allow that bully room to swing his fist. Scale that up to the energies we're thinking about, and if I were an ET, I'd be damn careful with how close I let a human mind approach me. And if, as Greer suggests, humans have been working with these energies for sixty years now, that approach may not be as unformed as I've been supposing....
xeemee ago
basically Greer posits that there are people deep on the inside that want this information to come out and that's why he is protected
when you dig into this further, i think you'll find that it's the people that tried to expose secrets in an a limited, anonymous way that committed "suicide" by shooting themselves ... in the back of the head ... twice :)
there are many examples, such as those that tried to patent resonant energy technology (study Tesla) - they get bought out, discredited, arrested, or killed when all else fails
Greer, and many others, have taken an opposite approach by blasting it into the public record and this does indeed seem to offer them a degree of protection
again though, be careful who you trust - at this point i personally have little reason to distrust Greer, yet i sense something is not exactly right - maybe he's just holding back information, maybe more, or maybe not - there are only a few people who i absolutely feel are 100% creditable and one of them is Bob Dean - another is Miriam Delicado - BUT, even in these cases, although i know for myself that these people are authentic and ethical, what i don't know is whether they were lied to
keep researching - it's a fascinating road!
and here's some bonus material...
look into Phil Schneider - he is one more of the very few people i trust whose ethics are absolutely unquestionable from my perspective - he "killed himself" by wrapping a rubber hose around his neck in an very unlikely "suicide" (read the autopsy reports) - it's people like this, who have been murdered, that you can bet know the truth, or at least significant parts thereof
zen_music ago
All right, thanks, I'll check it all out. Just came off several hours of research and my head is like a pumpkin.
deerhoof_fan ago
Anyone who has more than a cursory exposure to the subject knows that hardcore evidence exists, and that UFOs are a 100% real, documented phenomenon.
While possibly not aliens, definitely UFOs:
ASTRONAUTS
— Colonel Gordon Cooper, Mercury / Gemini Astronaut
— Captain Edgar Mitchell, Apollo 14 Astronaut
— Astronaut Eugene Cernan, Apollo 17 Commander
— Captain Donald Slayton, Mercury Astronaut
— Dr. Storey Musgrave, NASA Astronaut
— Astronaut Dr. Brian O'Leary
— Charles J. Camarda (Ph.D.), NASA Astronaut
NASA, CIA, ARMY, AIR FORCE ETC
— Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoetter, first Director of the CIA, 1947-1950
— Dr. J. Allen Hynek, Scientific consultant for Air Force Project Blue Book
— Air Chief Marshall Lord Hugh Dowding, Commanding Officer of the Royal Air Force during WWII
— J. Edgar Hoover, first Director of the FBI
— Ben Rich, former Head of the Lockheed Skunk Works
— General Nathan Twining, US Air Force, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff 1955-1958
— Rear Admiral Delmar Fahrney, USNR
— General Douglas MacArthur
ROCKET SCIENTISTS / PHYSICISTS
— Dr. Hermann Oberth, the "father of modern rocketry"
— Dr. Maurice Biot, leading aerodynamicists and mathematical physicist
— Dr. Harold Puthoff, Director, Institute for advanced studies at Austin, Author of fundamentals of Quantum Electronics
SOVIET / U.S. PRESIDENTS
— Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev
— President Harry S. Truman
— President Gerald Ford
— President Jimmy Carter
— President Ronald Reagan
Anyone is welcome to provide evidence that a quote is legitimately out of context, and I will remove it.
All credit goes to /u/Alx__ (on reddit) for compiling these. Sources for these quotes can be found at http://spaceflare.net. Many of them are on video, in context. For example, this one.
It is recognized that quotes are not proof. However:
There is compelling evidence that UFOs are physical phenomena, not imaginary or hallucinatory. They are captured on radar that only detects physical objects, and perform feats not explainable by known physics. 90-95% of sightings can be explained by known phenomena, but 5-10% cannot.
Source: The COMETA Report (published by the French government):
Part 1: http://www.ufoevidence.org/newsite/files/COMETA_part1.pdf
Part 2: http://www.ufoevidence.org/newsite/files/COMETA_part2.pdf
The former Governor of Arizona, also former pilot and Air Force officer, who witnessed the Phoenix Lights firsthand, describes the experience: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2SJXMBHByZY
UFOSKEPTIC.ORG, run by professional astrophysicist Bernard Haisch, was recommended by /r/askscience Mod /u/wbeaty, who also created and maintains amasci.com, a fantastic scientific resource in its own right.
More:
Regarding physical evidence -- there is little to none, other than trace evidence like evidence of exposure to high-powered electromagnetic fields in grass where craft are said to have landed.
Radar evidence
http://www.nicap.org/whatradar.htm
http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc614.htm
UFOs defy known physics:
http://www.ufoevidence.org/cases/case334.htm (one case of many)
FAQ
"The government wouldn't cover it up." - The US government didn't acknowledge the existence of Area 51 until last year.
Evidence of UFOs is compelling to the extent that to deny their existence is tantamount to science denial. Earnest study of available information makes it impossible to come away with the impression that they could be fictitious or hallucinatory. While this comment is just an introduction, it includes sources that can be explored to satisfy any doubts.
MUCH MORE here: http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/wtabz/computer_hacker_gary_mckinnon_has_no_choice_but/c5gbmqz
zen_music ago
Thanks, I really appreciate these contacts.
deerhoof_fan ago
For an excellent documentary on the best documented, most inexplicable cases of UFO sightings, check out "I Know What I Saw."
critias ago
I used to be very interested in UFOs, crop circles, Martian artifacts and other paranormal subjects when I was in my mid-teens. I used to watch all of the shows and read books about it.
As I grew up I started to realize that most fantastic things in our society match a theme of stories that are purely for entertainment and or influence. I found that most stories in human history are witnessed by uneducated, uninformed people who become useful idiots in perpetuating these tales for financial and political gain or to simply provide a distraction form real-world issues.
Reality is far more interesting but it is also a lot more troublesome. It's troublesome for the common people because if they knew the reality of things they would see how bad things are and also troublesome to the elite ruling class who do no want their subjects to revolt and to change reality.
I categorize aliens in with religion and entertainment. The fact is that the universe what with expansion and size almost completely negate the possibility of alien visitors. I won't say one way or another if they have been here because it's a pointless argument. I will say that we once believe a being came from another dimension or universe to create our universe and we called it God. We now know that god and religion were used to control populations by adjusting morality and feeding the masses promises and threats.
In this I see aliens as the same construct for a new generation.
We have many things in this world that are false but deemed as possible for the sake of keeping people distracted and loyal. Terrorism, religion, cult followings. They all use fear of the unknown to keep people passive.
The reality is not that we will be in contact with aliens. The reality is that we are being systematically abused and maneuvered in an attempt to reduce quality of life in this planet for the sake of the elite ruling class and that instead of wasting time with superstition, we should be trying to make the planet a utopia and create a promise of a future.
zen_music ago
Thank you. I agree with a large part of what you've said, most particularly your final paragraph. Certainly I'm not expecting somebody to come visit me any time soon; and I get what you're saying about the 'useful idiots', of which I may be one.
It's interesting to see that the idea of benevolent contact that was so much a part of my youth in the 50s and 60s seems to have given way to a much harsher, 'warriors from afar who know more than we do and haven't done us in just because we're insignificant' kind of rubric. So we're cast now in the place of having to 'steal' technology, and being told to 'stay away, you won't be tolerated here'.
I don't suppose I really care one way or the other if they're there (here), I just don't understand what is gained by secrecy and obfuscation. And, why some of the 'useful idiots' make some sense.
critias ago
The whole secrecy angle is just a way to perpetuate the mythos. There is nothing to hide but by pretending there is they can keep people paranoid. It also makes the government look more powerful than they really are.