If you have an argument against MGTOW post it in this thread - don't shit up the rest of the sub

To start with, you need to understand that "it's what jews want!!" isn't an argument. It's a claim. I could just as easily claim that jews want you to shield women from the consequences of their immorality by marrying them when they hit 30, are alpha widows, and have tyrone's kid in tow. Is my claim any less valid than yours?

If you want to argue against MGTOW, then you first have to understand what it is. As simply as I can put it, it's the idea that dating and marriage likely isn't worth it for men.

An analogous idea is that buying lottery tickets isn't worth it. I'm not denying that lottery winners exist. I'm just saying it's unlikely my ticket will win. I'm saying that I probably shouldn't organize my life around imagining a future where I win the lottery. I'm also not telling you not to play the lottery - I'm not going to follow you into a lottery subvoat and post memes about why the lottery is a bad idea. Please try not to get so triggered that you need to come into this subvoat and post memes about why the lottery is a good idea.

But okay, if you want to argue against MGTOW, then you need to come up with an argument that (1) dating and marriage will benefit me and (2) that those benefits outweigh the risks. If you don't address the risks (or you dismiss them by saying, "lol just marry a good woman") then you're not making a good argument.

And it almost doesn't matter because here's the thing - here's a giant red pill that anti-MGTOWers on Voat need to swallow: there is no shortage of marriage-worthy, marriage-minded men. There's a shortage of good women, but there's no shortage of good men.

If you could snap your fingers Thanos-style and turn every single MGTOW man into a card-carrying, jew-hating white nationalist, and you could set every single one of those men on a mission to find a marriage-worthy white woman and have 20 white babies with her, do you know what would happen? The number of white families would increase by precisely 0.

So if you really hate jews and want to save the white race, and your cunning plan for doing that is convincing MGTOW men to marry, you are an absolute fucking idiot. There are currently too few marriage-worthy women for the existing men. You're a fucking idiot if you're wasting your time trying to add more men to that mix.

If you actually want to help the white race - if you're serious about that - then you need to go talk to women. Make /v/traditionalwives more popular. Spread that message.

If you actually want to help the white race, you're wasting your time talking to me. I'm not the problem. MGTOW isn't the problem. If MGTOW goes away, that wont fix the problem.

Bonus: here's my advice to young men: keep yourself physically fit, morally straight, and intellectually sound. Cultivate attributes in yourself that make you useful. For example, learn woodworking; learn to fix shit. Develop a plan to learn a trade or start a career that actually pays money. Do not go into debt! (I paid for school with just 4 years in the military, and I came away debt free and better for the experience) Study hard because good grades will open doors for you, but don't accept leftist indoctrination - your ancestors were great and you have much to be proud of. Be quintessentially masculine - be strong, be confident, be assertive. Beyond that, be traditionally masculine (in the tradition of your white ancestors) - be protective, have moral values, use your strength to help others, not just yourself.

If you do these things, you will get women. If you waste your life with video games and pot, you'll achieve less.

Specific advice regarding women: try to find a wife while you're in high school. People gossip in high school and everyone knows everyone else's business. In high school, you'll know who the non-sluts are. Try to find a good girl with a good family a year or two younger than you. If you succeed, go ahead and marry her.

But if you can't find a good girl, don't compromise. Don't wife-up a "reformed whore." Don't rescue a damaged girl. Don't disrespect yourself by being someone's fallback choice - don't marry an alpha widow. I'm sorry to have to say it, but as you get older you're going to find that there are no marriage-worthy women left. Good women get married young and they stay married.