It's becoming clear that the Voting system on this site can be abused to restrict Free Speech on the site, and even Putt has made announcements addressing this issue a year ago. Now that issue is forcing itself to be known with the current band of Refugees on the Site.
We need to find a way to ensure that any Users on Voat can discuss their opinions without the fear of brigading, which can effectively silence users. The voting system is integral feature to the site that allows for tranding topics to hit the front page, but it's also a double edged sword since it can be used to silence people who are speaking their minds, but enough users don't agree with their opinion. Instead of discussing their differing opinions, Users will downvoat what they don't like, and when enough users downvoat like that, a user can be silenced for having the 'wrong' opinion.
If Voat is to survive the Qanons, we need to finally address the issue of how Voat can truly protect Free Speech. This hasn't been a problem in the past since most of the Goats around here agree with the status quo, but now we have a large group of newcomers who have a problem with the current Voat Culture. We need to come together and find a solution that ensures everyone can speak their mind without the fear of being brigaded.
14221215? ago
Any kind of social media voting system can be brigaded and abused. I think Facebook and Reddit are great examples of that. Forums tend to be come echo chambers when voting is added.
Some subverses here do not count comment points. Instead an upvote goes to a 3rd bucket, called "total upvotes given".
But how do you keep spammers out? Keep the reporting system, report all spam. Report all trolls. I use a progressive ban system, the first few bans are temporary to allow the people who just had a bad day try to change their ways and be more polite, the final ban is permanent.
14151427? ago
It’s easy dudes , downvoating is needed but not to be abused just make downvoatingharder like 100 upvoats on comments with monthly reset boom done ✅
14105737? ago
One lump. I myself am not a refugee. But I am new here. I am also an Anon. There's alot of us that are here because we were pointed in this direction as a place where we can chat and share ideas. So don't assume we are ALL refugees. With that being said..... Regrettably many have come here and dI'd not bother reading the rules or studying the culture. I think it helps that now there is a sticky at the top of the qtard board. It's a big world and theres all kinds. I want to thank you for your patience with all us nubes. I'm sure in no time most of us will be assemulated and you won't even notice were here...
14214997? ago
Soap Box had a spam war with Q Anon ? https://www.voat.co/v/AnonThoughts/2741557/14188896 Like a Story from a Video Game Fantasy?
14100945? ago
I like what you have to say here I am new and still learning how things work here I made one post on reddit and it was removed within hours so when I got here I was relived to see that free speech was considered proper here. but their are some who can't tolerate dissent it seems they trade insults down voating you in correlation with others knowing you cannot respond in kind.
having said that its a good lesson not to get into meaningless tirades and insults their is nothing to be gained or learned from it other than that all in all the experience so far so good unlike reddit
14078078? ago
This site is not user friendly.
14067417? ago
You forgot the third type: Faggots too chickenshit to post without anon.
14067826? ago
It must be hard knowing that your downvote won't impact my ability to post opinions you disagree with. Alas, my free speech goes uninhibited by your triggering.
14068226? ago
Only reddit tier fags worry about downvoats.
You must be new around here. Voats do not inhibit free speech. Voats do not hide the post.
Get your head out of your ass.
Faggot.
14068459? ago
Downvoats directly impact your ability to make posts.
Too many downvoats restrict your ability to post.
Unpopular opinions are typically met with Downvoats and 'Get fucked faggot' comments
Users who utilize their free speech and post unpopular opinions will have their free speech restricted.
14068517? ago
In other words, you're new, you're directly opposed to voat's incentives for actual conversation. Go away, newfag. Voat users have had this conversation with the admin a few times and guess what? We all always agree that these restrictions are important in order to get you to not be reddit tier trash.
lulz, retard.
Edit: get fucked, faggot.
14069177? ago
No, we haven't always agreed that the current system is a perfect system, which is why Putt opened the door for any ideas that could rectify the problems with the current system. To Quote Putt:
14069294? ago
Only a handful of moronic idiots who get their jimmies rustled because they want to spew shit all the time are the only people who take issue with it. They scream and yell so Putt keeps bringing it up and, like was previously said, it's always decided to leave it alone because it's always brought "to the table" that the only people screaming and crying are the ones who can't stop attacking other people because they can't act like fucking adults.
14069946? ago
I can't tell if you're intentionally or unintentionally misrepresenting the situation at hand. Putt wants to see users with unpopular opinions speak their minds without having their accounts restricted because the Voat Community doesn't like what they say.
14070267? ago
Dude, are you really still crying over this? For fuck's sake, shut up or go back to reddit. This argument has been beaten to death so many times now and the end result is always the same. You're not changing it no matter how much you whine and promise to suck Putt's dick.
14070357? ago
I'm still waiting for a valid argument. Reiterating 'Go back to reddit newfag' doesn't refute the claim that the current voting system can be used to restrict users from expressing their Free Speech.
14071414? ago
You want to destroy the very thing that keeps you from destroying voat and you want a "valid argument"? On an anon board no less. Entitled much?
14071520? ago
I want the system to improve, not to destroy the sight. Never have, and never will. The system we have works for the time being, but your tone will change once Qanons get their CCP up and decide bad words aren't acceptable on 'their site'
14083936? ago
So, like I said, you're new here, want to change the site to suit you. Retard. Won't happen.
14084262? ago
Either the system will be improved somehow, or the Voat culture will change each time Reddit does a large enough purge. This already happened once when Reddit purged around the time of the Pao takeover, and Voat was inundated with conservative views. There used to be civil discussions about liberal views that weren't downvoated for supporting leafy leaning ideals, and the front page wasn't littered with 'stupid niggers' and 'gas the kikes' posts. There were some amazing discussions that occured when the site was actually open to those discussions. Now you'll get downvoated instantaneously for even trying to start a discussion that doesnt condemn left leaning ideology right off the bat.
14084478? ago
100% wrong. You are used to safe spaces and screeches. If say something and back it up with stats, logic, and sources, and draw a logical conclusion while addressing weaknesses in your argument in the same post, you will at least get conversation and a mix of voats. In other words, if you talk and debate like you're actually educated instead of screeching like a libtard, you will get anything except pure negative responses. You absolutely can make good talking points and get agreement as long as you aren't a retard about it.
The solution isn't to change voat. The solution is to stop acting like a fucking idiot.
14084752? ago
Voat used to have a lot of Burnie Bros long before the Exodus occured, but live in denial all you want.
And I've expressed logical arguments in support of unpopular subjects on this site, made my claims and responded in a civil manner to crass responses (very similar to every single response you've given me here), and still have been downvoated because users think my opinion is wrong and I need to be silenced. God forbid they actually leave a comment and discuss the parts they don't agree with.
14085088? ago
Dude, you don't come in swinging your dick around trying to change people. And you don't post opinion. Opinions are like assholes: Everyone has one and they all stink. You present facts, ask questions, make an ironclad factual statement... you know, kind of like debate class. If you come in and state your opinion like it's the best thing since sliced bread, you're going to get the good ol' voat beat down, just like in debate class. This isn't digg or fark or reddit or facebook.
14086194? ago
Depends on if you're having a philosophical debate, but opinions can be reinforced with facts. Your initial claim is an opinion, and that should be reinforced with facts, but I don't know many people who utilize the debate format when they post their thoughts on an issue when sharing on a message board. You rarely see a post along the lines of this:
And more often see posts like this:
14086275? ago
Argumentum ad populum
Did you not see Putt's last post? Start with succinct, throw in some vulgarity somewhere along the way, finally get the details and consensus, end with insults and vulgarity. Voat has always been this way because it is the exercise of free speech while banishing safe spaces. And it works. It keeps the whiny libtards away, smashes 4chan each time it comes in to try to take over, and runs the reddit cancer fucks away.
It's like that for a reason and since it works, it's not going to change.
14086582? ago
There's nothing wrong with the style of presenting your stance, the problem is with restricting which stances you're allowed to take. If you take the stance that is popular with Voat (i.e. gas the kikes), then you'll get a net positive SCP or CCP vote. If you take an unpopular stance (i.e. minimum wage for full time employees should run parallel with the local cost of living), then you'll get a net negative SCP or CCP vote. Both are opinions, both can be backed with facts, both can have the same presentation, but Voat will downvote the unpopular opinion simply because they don't agree with it, which is not what how the voting system was designed to be used.
14087166? ago
IE: Free speech.
We've already covered this.
Again, we've already covered this and how to present unpopular opinions. You haven't been listening and I'm not it's worth my time to cover it again.
14087212? ago
You have yet to make a irrefutable claim that a user with negative CCP still has unrestricted free speech.
14087585? ago
You have yet to acknowledge that you can't come in here expecting to change the site because you don't like it. This kind of circular time-wasting bullshit is why you get negative CCP. You went through all the motions without any intention of actually listening. You just wanted to sound like you were and had no intention of actually changing your mind or seriously considering what's there. You want to change it for you and people remember that shit. That's what has your jimmies all rustled. You can't break in and take control.
14087820? ago
Still not arguing my claim that negative CCP restricts users free speech. And I wont address the Ad Hominem which is what your argument is based in.
14067411? ago
There are plenty of community moderation tools that would work well for a free speech site. Copying reddit's retarded system is not one of them.
14067878? ago
90% of the Voat site parallels Reddit; the communication style, the karma/voting system, the subreddit/subverse system, the concept of moderation for subs, the organization and sorting of posts in Front Page, All, New, and more. One of the key differences is the transparency of upper management on this site (mod logs, bans, etc)
14064916? ago
So what you're saying is concede to limited free speech. That's what you're saying.
Things we're great before Q. Qtards are the enemy.
14065219? ago
Not at all, I want unrestricted Free Speech on Voat, be it popular or unpopular opinions. If you have a popular opinion then you have the right to express it; if you have an unpopular opinion, then I don't want to see your speech restricted because your CCP has gone into the negatives. I want to see open discussions for all discussions, not just what one community or another determines to be acceptable topics.
14078124? ago
You are so right. There should be no restriction on Free speech. You may not like what someone else says. Call them out tell them.. but they have the Right to speak... even if they are a troll.
14064356? ago
Here, have a down voat!
14064381? ago
That's very white of you, thank you!
14064400? ago
What is white?
14078141? ago
White is the absence of all color................................
14078759? ago
Nope, all colors together. Nice try qtard
14064515? ago
It's a phrase when referring to an act of kindness:
"Hey, do you mind taking care of X?"
"Already did it dude"
"Ah! Mighty white of you sir!"
14064560? ago
save your urban dictionary lingo for the nig-nogs pal
14064590? ago
Well the saying predates the internet, let alone urban dictionary, but whatever.
14064113? ago
If the post or opinion is not removed, I don't see how they have been silenced. It's there for anyone to see if they look for it. I don't have to see or read your opinion. That is not "free speech". This is whining because "muh opinion" is unpopular. Grow a set, get off the internet everyone once in a while and live life, nigger faggot.
14064226? ago
Once the post has been made, then the user has expressed free speech in that situation. If that post gets that user's CCP into the negatives, then it prevents them from expressing their Free Speech in the future.
14063740? ago
Opinions aren’t silenced. Just ignored or pushed to the fringe. Free Speech doesn’t mean everyone has to listen to you. It just means you have the right to talk.
14064145? ago
BINGO!
14063816? ago
If account restrictions weren't tied to the voting system, then I would agree with that claim. However you can silence a user by knocking their CCP down into the Negatives and start restricting their ability to speak on this site.
However, we currently need account restrictions to be tied to CCPs as it helps the community control spam on the site. Until we find a good solution to silencing spammers but allowing people to speak their minds, we have to keep what we have.
15063619? ago
We should just lose the <0 CCP scores, then you can never be more than 10 CCP's worth of good behaviour away from being able to post.
14179938? ago
I was silenced shortly after arriving at Voat with a -15 score so wouldn't be able to publish my own posts at this site. And you are right, the people who downvoted me, restricted the very thing (free speech) that they glorify. And I didn't antagonize anyone. Asking for a little decorum (this site and the language used can be shocking to the system of a newbie) was my crime.
14065300? ago
The people who get downloaded to the point of account restrictions are those actively antagonizing people. Now we do have free speech because you are still allowed to talk but there is no place where you can just scream and yell and antagonize people without some sort of repercussions. In real life if you are being disorderly in example, yelling screaming antagonizing people the cops can come and ticket you or take you out to jail to cool off
14065484? ago
I would agree to an extent. Most people get downvoated for instigating a situation, but that isn't the case for all situations. You maintain a civil discussion about controversial topics on Voat and still be downvoated for having the wrong opinion. Voat is better than Reddit when it comes to Free Speech, but there are some parallels between the two communities still. If you bring up black violence on Reddit, you'll get downvoted to oblivion. If you talk about the merits of Blacks on Voat, then you'll get downvoated to oblivion.
14074950? ago
But those people you're talking about do not get downvoated to the point of not being able to post as much as I want which is the only form of censorship that voat has.
14076195? ago
Why would you want someone to be censored?
14076248? ago
Sorry that was a voice to text typo. It's fixed now
14076887? ago
Fair enough on the clarification. Putt has stated that he wishes there would be no censorship of any of the Voat users (excluding spammers of course), and with the Qanons on the site planning to downvote users who use 'offensive words', I suspect this censorship will become a problem for mainstream Goats.
14064157? ago
Well let's start with your anon post then, or would that not be fair either? So much bitching.
14064273? ago
I dont see this post being spammed in multiple subs.
14063692? ago
There is a third type of user that hides behind anon posts.
14063741? ago
Makes smashing that downvote button pretty pointless, huh? You gotta make your point before you can prove OP is a faggot.
14062820? ago
ALLOW PEOPLE TO BLOCK SUBMISSIONS FROM AN INDIVIDUAL USER INSTEAD OF WHOLE SUBS.
There's no need to find and block every possible porn sub if you block the 4 people who post to them.
14221280? ago
You can already block a user here. I don't know if a blocked user can still downvote your comment or post though.
14063437? ago
There might be something to this. If a user has blocked you, then you're unable to vote on any of their content. Same with anyone you've blocked, you can't vote on the material of a user you've blocked. If you choose not to participate with some user, then you can't manipulate that user's CCP or SCP.
14073833? ago
I'd rather have an option just for submissions, with maybe a 2nd button for FULL SNOWFLAKE MODE.
I don't hate the guys who only post porns or long boring youtube monologues, I just am not interested in their submissions.
14074457? ago
No one is forcing you to look at those? This isn't about forcing unpopular opinions to the front for everyone to look at, it's about making sure users aren't silenced for speaking their minds.
14074576? ago
Um, right? Did you forget we were talking about me being able to hide their submissions?
I'm saying just because someone posts only bagpipe videos, that doesn't mean I need a button to mute all his comments too. I might like him despite not liking his hobby and maybe I wouldn't want to hide all his comments, only his submissions.
But the Qtards probably do want to hide all comments from anyone who says Jew, and why not let them?
14074856? ago
Oh right, this conversation, sorry! I wonder if this can be an extension of the block feature that's already implemented in the site.
However, this wouldnt necessarily stop a spiteful user from stalking a user and downvoting everything they submit, be it comments or submissions.
14062495? ago
@freshmeat, fuck off.
14063377? ago
Hot damn, I've finally been accused of being an alt! I can scratch that one off my Voat bucket list now, but I still need to be called an Amalek and SGIS alt before my life is complete
14062944? ago
Agreed. Brainwashed christ nigs go elsewhere. No amount of crying will remove things from the internet that hurt your delicate fee fees.
14061950? ago
SaneGoat used to complain about his free speech being infringed upon by downvoats
14063404? ago
SGIS had some valid points intermixed with all his shitposting. 90% of his spam was bullshit, but even a broken clock is right twice a day.
14064108? ago
Oh I think he's a freakin lunatic, but this Q situation seems to parallel.
We outnumbered him, even with his alts, so it was trivial to keep the shit out of sight.
Likewise, the Qtards outnumber us, and are able to both flood the front page with their stuff, as well as hide our posts about them.
14064315? ago
Hence why I made this post, since we're about to face a wave of censorship once the Qfugees start getting sufficient CCP levels. We need a solution to prevent Voat from being invaded and silenced.
14061457? ago
Pretty god damn motherfucking sure ive said repeatedly hiding posts due to downvotes is a fucktarded idea. To the bottom of the queue is sufficient.
14064003? ago
the obvious answer is just to eliminate the downvote button altogether.
14061565? ago
So you're okay with it happening to you when the Qanon's target you for their downvoating brigades?
14061721? ago
You can just sort by new and scroll to the bottom of a thread if no posts get hidden due to downvotes. Are you mentally damaged? Have you not comprehended a single word I wrote?
14061104? ago
Make it so you must subscribe to a sub to downvoat. Users can not downvote more than upvoat in any sub.
14061436? ago
Dumb idea.
14061166? ago
And how would we protect against spam then?
Your system is utterly vulnerable to being overrun because you prevented the sub from protecting itself.
Good job.
14061161? ago
This is an interesting idea. Would maybe help combat the downvotes that come from users just refreshing v/all/new
14061157? ago
That would prevent the Voat immune system from responding to Upvote farms, which violates Voat Policy. Since the recent additions to the site have been trying to circumvent that rule, I suspect we'll need to keep the ability to downvoat in Subs unrestricted since there will always be bad apples that try to work around Voat Rules.
14061056? ago
How about upvotes only, get rid of downvotes?
14061172? ago
Ooh! Just like FACEBOOK!
14061105? ago
Unfortunately the voting system is used to address the never-ending supply of spammers on this site, until an effective alternative is found for the site. We have a Report Spam button, but I'm uncertain how effective that system is, and I assume it requires human oversight to prevent it from being abused.
14061195? ago
With cynabuns and Putt being more active spam should be removed pretty fast these days. But then again their two main spam helpers left voat about 6 months ago due to lack of communication and transparency from Putt. So there’s that too.
14061297? ago
Both Putt and Cynabuns have real lives outside of Voat, and they shouldn't be forced to moniter this site pro bono. The fact that this site has many enemies that would love to silence users makes it hard to find replacement users for those positions.
14060998? ago
Cowardpost is posted in cowardmode.
Oy vey, downvotes are censorship, goy. Stop effectively protecting your site against my sloppy army.
14061017? ago
Refute the logic rather than resort to character attacks.
14064025? ago
as you "censor" with your down voat.
14064074? ago
I didn't downvote you dude; that get's reserved for spammers, beggars, and vote farmers.
14064267? ago
I wasn't referring to me. See how hard it is to know who you are talking to in pussy anon mode?
14064355? ago
Then I didnt downvote them for expressing their opinion, I reserve that for spammers, beggars, and vote farmers.
And nothing worthwhile in this world will come easy, it just means I'll have to be a little more specific in my conversations.
14064378? ago
Moving into my house and then demanding I change my rules to suit you is not going to be easy.
14064408? ago
Kinda why I made this post; Qanon is trying to do just that.
14064476? ago
I really don't see a problem. I blocked all their shit-verses until they settle down.
14061138? ago
No we don't, and you are wrong.
You're attempting to neuter the Voat immune system because you are working for people trying to silence all of Voat.
Voat as a whole has its say about everyone else's topic and whether it has merit. We do this through voting, which is earned.
Newcomers need to sack up and fucking deal with it - like everyone did before them.
Refugees trying to change the local culture... I've seen this before, hmm...
14061496? ago
Its not earned when they circle jerk and upvote each othe retard.
14062604? ago
"A few people misuse things so now you all get punished"
Oh, ok. You must be a big proponent of gun control, too.
No thanks, I think I'll keep my liberty. Nobody has a problem with downvotes except people trying to abuse the system.
14061261? ago
I've taken part in the Voat Immune system; users trying to spam the site or beg for upvotes are acting against Voat as a whole.
People voicing unpopular opinions have a right to speak their minds on the last stronghold or Free Speech. To make the claim that the Voat community acts exclusively on merit and not on their personal biases is asinine.
New Users trying to walk in and tell people they can't say Nigger, Faggot, Kike are part of the problem, and now those people represent a real threat to Free Speech on Voat. We need to find a solution that allows people to say whatever words they choose without being downvoat brigaded. It's only a matter of time until the Qanons get enough CCP in their subs to be able to start targeting Old Goats and actively downvoating them on every comment they make.
14062822? ago
By your flawed logic everybody on fatpeoplehate is an existential threat to Voat itself, given that there are 39,000 of them and they are much more liberal than anywhere else on Voat.
Oh gosh, just think of how terrible it will be when all those 3.2 year old accounts finally get enough CCP to downvote - they'll take over the site!
Except they haven't, because your concern is fake and you just want to remove downvotes because you can't handle people having their say, via downvotes, telling you your ideas are without value.
That's why you post in cowardmode.
14063490? ago
They haven't openly discussed the concept of Brigading Voat the way that Qanons have, nor have they claimed to usurp the Voat Culture the way Qanons have either. Qanons have claimed Voat to be their site, and that they will cleanse this site of it's bigots to make it their own.
14063700? ago
Wow, you better run to phuks.co then.
Cya.
14061772? ago
So you think old goats forcing them to spend time immersed in this culture before they have the power to do that is a bad thing? You know these are the type of people that down vote "racists" right?
14061942? ago
I don't. In fact I think it would strengthen their resolve to get to the full Voat experience so that they can finally speak their minds. But that's if they actually attempted to integrate rather than hiding in their subs and circlejerking their legitimate posts, and then proceed to start downvoating everything not Q repeated on the site.
What I want to see is a future proof Voat when it comes to Free Speech, since Reddit will continue to purge more Subs, and those subs will have their share of thin-skinned normies that will want to silence opinions they dont agree with. Voat does this already, but we dont need any more of that occurring. We should find a solution to this before a negligible issue becomes a real problem.