Orthodox Mormons have a long history of child to old man marriage. Not uncommon for a teen girl to be kicked out of her home because she refused to marry an older man. I've seen it first hand it's pretty sad.
These people are not affiliated with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Conflating the two is a deep disservice to the cause of truth and justice.
Are you suggesting that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints collects tithes from FLDS splinter groups? That idea is ridiculous on its face and I defy you to demonstrate otherwise.
You're asking me to prove a negative, which is always impossible.
The Church collects donations from its members. It wouldn't ask such donations of FLDS groups because they are not members. I can conceive of no reason they would offer such donations any more than I could imagine a Catholic donating to the Church.
As our detractors are fond of pointing out, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is prosperous. It has no need of FLDS money.
I've asked you to demonstrate otherwise. You did not do so. Therefore, I can only assume that your accusations are pulled from thin air.
You are trying too hard to focus on the FLDS. It's like arguing moderate vs extremist muslims. We just sit by and let the kids get fucked by old men we don't actually fuck the kids...
Do some mormons marry children to adults? y/n?
Do girls get abandoned/shunned by their families for refusing arranged marriages? y/n
I'm an old fart now, I've lived all over the US, and the only place where It was socially acceptable for a 13 year old to marry a 40 year old was in Utah. And they weren't wearing the amish old timey style flds cloths...
Big organizations get corrupt. Just look at the catholic church. Your claim is like saying there are no pedo clergy in the catholic church. It happens you might not like that it happens you may wish and pray it didn't. That doesn't change the facts.
I'm sure there are dozens of books and news articles proving me right, I don't care enough to bother finding them. All I know is what I know first hand. I seen it and I help them get away from it. Doing so everyone I talked to seemed to think it was a common occurrence, I only saw one instance so I can't speak for how wide spread it is. All I know is it happens. Bury your head in the sand if you want and live in a fantasy land it doesn't effect me one bit.
By "Mormon" I'm going to assume you mean members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, which FLDS are not. Different organizations, different philosophies, and very different missions. So I outright reject your analogy vis a vis moderate vs extremist Muslims. The analogy is more like Evangelical Christians vs. Jonestown. There is a common heritage, but to equate them is incorrect to the point of insulting.
So, since we have our terms straight:
Do some mormons marry children to adults? y/n?
No. This would be an excommunicable offense.
Do girls get abandoned/shunned by their families for refusing arranged marriages? y/n
No. We have our share of messed up families, but neither child abandonment nor arranged marriage is condoned.
the only place where It was socially acceptable for a 13 year old to marry a 40 year old was in Utah.
Once again, you're conflating a tiny group with a large population. It's an outright misrepresentation. Frankly, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not just yanking my chain at this point, your arguments are so unserious.
Big organizations get corrupt.
Look, we have our share of scumbags. But when bad actors are detected they are rooted out as quickly as possible and referred to law enforcement as appropriate. We have no cultural tolerance whatsoever for the kind of behavior you're suggesting.
Can I guarantee that nothing you're suggesting has EVER happened? Of course not, and to expect me to make that argument is pure sophistry on your part. But it's not sanctioned, permitted, condoned, or accepted at any organizational or cultural level. What more can you expect from a large organization?
I'm sure there are dozens of books and news articles proving me right
There are lots of lies, half-truths, and innuendos out there. The library of anti-Mormon literature is expansive. That's what happens when Satan wages war. But just because it gets published doesn't mean it's true. As an 'old fart' I'd suspect you've figured this out by now.
All I know is what I know first hand. I seen it and I help them get away from it.
I'm grateful and glad that you helped. A sincere thank you for that. To paint it as anything more than an isolated incident, however, is well beyond your purview if you only have knowledge of one incident.
Nobody's burying their head in the sand. We're explicitly warned in our scriptures to resist the idea that "all is well in Zion." (2 Nephi 28:21) The parable of the wheat and the tares was provided for a reason. But the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, notwithstanding the imperfections and even evil of a few of its members, is one of the greatest forces for good this world has ever seen, inspiring many people to accept Christ as their Savior and reach higher in their service and love toward Him and toward their fellowman.
The fundamental thing that I know is that Jesus Christ is my Savior and that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints led me to Him. No evil thing leads to Christ.
You certainly make a good spokesmen for the the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I'm not saying all Mormons are bad not sure why you guys all of a sudden started distancing yourself from that term. In fact, They are probably one of the most admirable groups in the US. Strong focus on family and anti-drug they have some problems but, nothing too bad. Even our distasteful topic we talk about here they don't do it out of malice, They do it out of tradition, it used to be the most normal thing in the world. Now days not so much.
However, People do leave the church on a regular basis. Maybe you should talk to some of them and find out why they left. Unless the church forbids you..
Lol the Church has no control over who we talk to. We understand why people leave and if they think they can find more happiness away from the Gospel then we wish them the best. They are accepted back with open arms should they choose.
Most of our problems in the battle for truth come from those who feel driven to prove to themselves that they made the right choice. They tend to become militant in their opposition. It's alright, opposition is necessary and makes us stronger.
To answer your question, the change in terminology was encouraged by our leadership at the last General Conference. The purpose is to stress our relationship with Christ and His role as the head of the Church of Jesus Christ. The term "Mormon" undermines that and gives an incorrect impression of what we're about. It's an effort to correct that error. Here's President Nelson's instruction on the matter, if you're curious:
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15901594? ago
Orthodox Mormons have a long history of child to old man marriage. Not uncommon for a teen girl to be kicked out of her home because she refused to marry an older man. I've seen it first hand it's pretty sad.
15904151? ago
These people are not affiliated with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Conflating the two is a deep disservice to the cause of truth and justice.
15904814? ago
Yea, that's what the church says but they take their tithes all the same.
15905238? ago
Are you suggesting that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints collects tithes from FLDS splinter groups? That idea is ridiculous on its face and I defy you to demonstrate otherwise.
15913127? ago
So you can without a shadow of a doubt say there is not a single case of it happening? If you think that, you are delusional.
15913629? ago
You're asking me to prove a negative, which is always impossible.
The Church collects donations from its members. It wouldn't ask such donations of FLDS groups because they are not members. I can conceive of no reason they would offer such donations any more than I could imagine a Catholic donating to the Church.
As our detractors are fond of pointing out, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is prosperous. It has no need of FLDS money.
I've asked you to demonstrate otherwise. You did not do so. Therefore, I can only assume that your accusations are pulled from thin air.
15913947? ago
You are trying too hard to focus on the FLDS. It's like arguing moderate vs extremist muslims. We just sit by and let the kids get fucked by old men we don't actually fuck the kids...
Do some mormons marry children to adults? y/n?
Do girls get abandoned/shunned by their families for refusing arranged marriages? y/n
I'm an old fart now, I've lived all over the US, and the only place where It was socially acceptable for a 13 year old to marry a 40 year old was in Utah. And they weren't wearing the amish old timey style flds cloths...
Big organizations get corrupt. Just look at the catholic church. Your claim is like saying there are no pedo clergy in the catholic church. It happens you might not like that it happens you may wish and pray it didn't. That doesn't change the facts.
I'm sure there are dozens of books and news articles proving me right, I don't care enough to bother finding them. All I know is what I know first hand. I seen it and I help them get away from it. Doing so everyone I talked to seemed to think it was a common occurrence, I only saw one instance so I can't speak for how wide spread it is. All I know is it happens. Bury your head in the sand if you want and live in a fantasy land it doesn't effect me one bit.
That's all I have to say about that.
15915558? ago
By "Mormon" I'm going to assume you mean members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, which FLDS are not. Different organizations, different philosophies, and very different missions. So I outright reject your analogy vis a vis moderate vs extremist Muslims. The analogy is more like Evangelical Christians vs. Jonestown. There is a common heritage, but to equate them is incorrect to the point of insulting.
So, since we have our terms straight:
No. This would be an excommunicable offense.
No. We have our share of messed up families, but neither child abandonment nor arranged marriage is condoned.
Once again, you're conflating a tiny group with a large population. It's an outright misrepresentation. Frankly, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not just yanking my chain at this point, your arguments are so unserious.
Look, we have our share of scumbags. But when bad actors are detected they are rooted out as quickly as possible and referred to law enforcement as appropriate. We have no cultural tolerance whatsoever for the kind of behavior you're suggesting.
Can I guarantee that nothing you're suggesting has EVER happened? Of course not, and to expect me to make that argument is pure sophistry on your part. But it's not sanctioned, permitted, condoned, or accepted at any organizational or cultural level. What more can you expect from a large organization?
There are lots of lies, half-truths, and innuendos out there. The library of anti-Mormon literature is expansive. That's what happens when Satan wages war. But just because it gets published doesn't mean it's true. As an 'old fart' I'd suspect you've figured this out by now.
I'm grateful and glad that you helped. A sincere thank you for that. To paint it as anything more than an isolated incident, however, is well beyond your purview if you only have knowledge of one incident.
Nobody's burying their head in the sand. We're explicitly warned in our scriptures to resist the idea that "all is well in Zion." (2 Nephi 28:21) The parable of the wheat and the tares was provided for a reason. But the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, notwithstanding the imperfections and even evil of a few of its members, is one of the greatest forces for good this world has ever seen, inspiring many people to accept Christ as their Savior and reach higher in their service and love toward Him and toward their fellowman.
The fundamental thing that I know is that Jesus Christ is my Savior and that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints led me to Him. No evil thing leads to Christ.
15917373? ago
You certainly make a good spokesmen for the the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I'm not saying all Mormons are bad not sure why you guys all of a sudden started distancing yourself from that term. In fact, They are probably one of the most admirable groups in the US. Strong focus on family and anti-drug they have some problems but, nothing too bad. Even our distasteful topic we talk about here they don't do it out of malice, They do it out of tradition, it used to be the most normal thing in the world. Now days not so much.
However, People do leave the church on a regular basis. Maybe you should talk to some of them and find out why they left. Unless the church forbids you..
15921873? ago
Lol the Church has no control over who we talk to. We understand why people leave and if they think they can find more happiness away from the Gospel then we wish them the best. They are accepted back with open arms should they choose.
Most of our problems in the battle for truth come from those who feel driven to prove to themselves that they made the right choice. They tend to become militant in their opposition. It's alright, opposition is necessary and makes us stronger.
To answer your question, the change in terminology was encouraged by our leadership at the last General Conference. The purpose is to stress our relationship with Christ and His role as the head of the Church of Jesus Christ. The term "Mormon" undermines that and gives an incorrect impression of what we're about. It's an effort to correct that error. Here's President Nelson's instruction on the matter, if you're curious:
https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2018/10/the-correct-name-of-the-church?lang=eng
Thank you for the kind words.