Srayzie was listed as a mod in v/pizzagate but never did any modding. I added her as part of the new team I put in place after Falcon was suddenly demodded in February of 2017 because she was respected by many pizzagate researchers. I also added Blacksmith21, think-, Ben and Eric and Honeybee_, a respected pedo exposer with a YouTube channel.
The reality was that Falcon's heavy-handed administration of our draconian submission rules combined with trolls constantly whipping up hate against the mod team, had pushed morale and trust to an all-time-low. So I asked a number of respected users to join me, and we instituted the 24 Hour Grace flair -- which allowed people to edit their submissions to bring them into compliance with the onerous rules.
Srayzie found the rules too complicated to enforce under the blistering eyes of Kev. She was a mod in name only, up until the day she deleted her account.
Too much power concentrated in one group.
The only concentrated power was in the hands of Kev, who unilaterally changed the Grace Flair users had voted on, unbanned a bunch of people without consulting me or the userbase, unilaterally axed Falcon in a way that caused our only engaged and civil O at the time to quit in disgust, and demodded the only new mod I had who was willing to confront trolls (without consulting me at all), for failing to give a rule-breaking submission an edit flair in the first or second week he was on the job, still learning how to mod.
At least the part about Falcon I know wasn't unilateral because I was involved at that time. Anyway thanks on the rest of your info. Starting to get a picture of what went wrong .
So VictorSteinerDavion lost his shit over nothing? That seems unlikely to me. He was a highly rational guy and very measured in his assessments, much like you.
I'm not sure what VictorSteiner did or didn't do after MF was removed and I'm not going to pretend I have any insight into what makes him tick. I do remember seeing him being very upset afterwards that he wasn't included or his input sought but there may have been more than that.
I really didn't take much notice after MF was removed though beyond reading what the pizzagate members reactions were to it. From my external view he was treating more than just the trolls and shit stirrers badly and everyone who was consulted on it eventually agreed to his removal, even if some were begrudging. The community was mostly supportive of him being gone. Thats my memory of it.
Yes, that's correct. Everyone agreed he became a terrible mod. In the link we're referencing above, VSD resigned as O because Kev was made an O and banned Falcon without consulting him at all. He felt it was corrupt. It's right there in his last comment before he left Voat.
Yea but I don't really think thats relevant to the current situation. He might not have been aware of the process behind kevdude finally demodding MF and he was (probably rightly) pissed he wasn't included. I also remember some agitators at the time which you have named there and the warning bells they gave off to me and one of the last things I did was warn some people via PM about some of their actions at the time.
The whole reason I got into that mod removal debate in the first place is because I thought the pizzagate community needed extra protection. All of us mods and owners of PV did at the time and when they first arrived here.
Shortly after all that I gave up all my mod positions because I had personal things going on and basically left Voat, bar dropping in occasionally. I still don't have time to read everything here that goes on, much less care about some of it. What I do care about is that the people of pizzagate and GA have a place to talk about what they want to talk about. Free speech is about much more than individual expression and people who want to silence Q and PG are willing to play dirty and roll in the gutter and if you want to contest that and protect the members(lets face it a lot of them are not as equipped as the usual Voat user to deal with trolling), then you have to adapt and fight them a different way.
What I do care about is that the people of pizzagate and GA have a place to talk about what they want to talk about.
Thank you for this.
Free speech is about much more than individual expression and people who want to silence Q and PG are willing to play dirty and roll in the gutter and if you want to contest that and protect the members(lets face it a lot of them are not as equipped as the usual Voat user to deal with trolling), then you have to adapt and fight them a different way.
Yes. I would love to hear more of your thoughts on that.
Just remember that also extends to people wanting to use the ProtectVoat sub to talk about issues they care about as well. Things somehow got into a huge mess over at GA and that's unfortunate but as I said right at the start of this, things don't have to be the way they are currently. There are quite a few people very happy that Voat is getting divided and they are taking notes on how to do it.
There are quite a few people very happy that Voat is getting divided and they are taking notes on how to do it.
Those jackals have always been here. Every little conflict or misstep brings them out in droves in v/pizzagate, and the community has had no way to keep that toxic spew from filling their research threads these past almost three years.
From my point of view, it's a good thing for goats to experience what we've had to. Maybe as a result, we will no longer be divided.
I think PV would take the crown for the amount of troll threads it has had. Literally thousands(not an exaggeration) of threads calling for the admins death by one guy, and used to make at least 50 threads a day here at one point and did similar things in the v/whatever threatening to kill the admins and us. Another one iused to take pictures of his own shit and post them to PV. Surely you remember the numbers guy spamming the sub with 20-30 posts a day in more recent times? Goats are used to that sort of shit and probably cant understand why it would drive someone away.
PV isn't a research sub, and I suspect the one individual you you're talking about didn't come from SBBH and didn't stand by @kevdude. So while PV was created to bait mods into behaving badly by using persistent trolling from in house trolls, that one guy probably wasn't one of them.
When one realizes the amount of drama that is created on behalf of PV, by and for PV, to flex their authority (backed by trolls), it is something to consider on whether staying on voat is worth it. When it undermines the purpose and function and free speech of users within research subs, under the guise of "protecting", considering leaving isn't the same as giving up under the pressure of an outside influence that the community is working together to deal with, because it already is a divided community.
PV only acknowledges the idea of division when they don't get their way after subversively meddling within research subs.
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Dismember ago
See with that and moddingGA and PV this shit was always bound to happen in some form. Too much power concentrated in one group.
Vindicator ago
Srayzie was listed as a mod in v/pizzagate but never did any modding. I added her as part of the new team I put in place after Falcon was suddenly demodded in February of 2017 because she was respected by many pizzagate researchers. I also added Blacksmith21, think-, Ben and Eric and Honeybee_, a respected pedo exposer with a YouTube channel.
The reality was that Falcon's heavy-handed administration of our draconian submission rules combined with trolls constantly whipping up hate against the mod team, had pushed morale and trust to an all-time-low. So I asked a number of respected users to join me, and we instituted the 24 Hour Grace flair -- which allowed people to edit their submissions to bring them into compliance with the onerous rules.
The one day that srayzie tried to help because several of us were AFK, as we were just rolling out the 24 Hour Grace flair, Kev took issue with a rule-breaking post that was not handled exactly right and read her the riot act and demodded Blacksmith21 before I got back to the board the next day and made the comment linked.
Srayzie found the rules too complicated to enforce under the blistering eyes of Kev. She was a mod in name only, up until the day she deleted her account.
The only concentrated power was in the hands of Kev, who unilaterally changed the Grace Flair users had voted on, unbanned a bunch of people without consulting me or the userbase, unilaterally axed Falcon in a way that caused our only engaged and civil O at the time to quit in disgust, and demodded the only new mod I had who was willing to confront trolls (without consulting me at all), for failing to give a rule-breaking submission an edit flair in the first or second week he was on the job, still learning how to mod.
think- ago
Err....what?
Dismember ago
At least the part about Falcon I know wasn't unilateral because I was involved at that time. Anyway thanks on the rest of your info. Starting to get a picture of what went wrong .
Vindicator ago
So VictorSteinerDavion lost his shit over nothing? That seems unlikely to me. He was a highly rational guy and very measured in his assessments, much like you.
Dismember ago
I'm not sure what VictorSteiner did or didn't do after MF was removed and I'm not going to pretend I have any insight into what makes him tick. I do remember seeing him being very upset afterwards that he wasn't included or his input sought but there may have been more than that.
I really didn't take much notice after MF was removed though beyond reading what the pizzagate members reactions were to it. From my external view he was treating more than just the trolls and shit stirrers badly and everyone who was consulted on it eventually agreed to his removal, even if some were begrudging. The community was mostly supportive of him being gone. Thats my memory of it.
Vindicator ago
Yes, that's correct. Everyone agreed he became a terrible mod. In the link we're referencing above, VSD resigned as O because Kev was made an O and banned Falcon without consulting him at all. He felt it was corrupt. It's right there in his last comment before he left Voat.
Dismember ago
Yea but I don't really think thats relevant to the current situation. He might not have been aware of the process behind kevdude finally demodding MF and he was (probably rightly) pissed he wasn't included. I also remember some agitators at the time which you have named there and the warning bells they gave off to me and one of the last things I did was warn some people via PM about some of their actions at the time.
The whole reason I got into that mod removal debate in the first place is because I thought the pizzagate community needed extra protection. All of us mods and owners of PV did at the time and when they first arrived here.
Shortly after all that I gave up all my mod positions because I had personal things going on and basically left Voat, bar dropping in occasionally. I still don't have time to read everything here that goes on, much less care about some of it. What I do care about is that the people of pizzagate and GA have a place to talk about what they want to talk about. Free speech is about much more than individual expression and people who want to silence Q and PG are willing to play dirty and roll in the gutter and if you want to contest that and protect the members(lets face it a lot of them are not as equipped as the usual Voat user to deal with trolling), then you have to adapt and fight them a different way.
Vindicator ago
Thank you for this.
Yes. I would love to hear more of your thoughts on that.
Dismember ago
Just remember that also extends to people wanting to use the ProtectVoat sub to talk about issues they care about as well. Things somehow got into a huge mess over at GA and that's unfortunate but as I said right at the start of this, things don't have to be the way they are currently. There are quite a few people very happy that Voat is getting divided and they are taking notes on how to do it.
Vindicator ago
Those jackals have always been here. Every little conflict or misstep brings them out in droves in v/pizzagate, and the community has had no way to keep that toxic spew from filling their research threads these past almost three years.
From my point of view, it's a good thing for goats to experience what we've had to. Maybe as a result, we will no longer be divided.
Dismember ago
I think PV would take the crown for the amount of troll threads it has had. Literally thousands(not an exaggeration) of threads calling for the admins death by one guy, and used to make at least 50 threads a day here at one point and did similar things in the v/whatever threatening to kill the admins and us. Another one iused to take pictures of his own shit and post them to PV. Surely you remember the numbers guy spamming the sub with 20-30 posts a day in more recent times? Goats are used to that sort of shit and probably cant understand why it would drive someone away.
kestrel9 ago
PV isn't a research sub, and I suspect the one individual you you're talking about didn't come from SBBH and didn't stand by @kevdude. So while PV was created to bait mods into behaving badly by using persistent trolling from in house trolls, that one guy probably wasn't one of them.
When one realizes the amount of drama that is created on behalf of PV, by and for PV, to flex their authority (backed by trolls), it is something to consider on whether staying on voat is worth it. When it undermines the purpose and function and free speech of users within research subs, under the guise of "protecting", considering leaving isn't the same as giving up under the pressure of an outside influence that the community is working together to deal with, because it already is a divided community.
PV only acknowledges the idea of division when they don't get their way after subversively meddling within research subs.