12 years of government schools and two university degrees and never was what happened to Germany mentioned. Thanks for posting this, I’m sharing it with my family
That sounds like a strait propaganda line of bullshit used to justify dropping atomic bombs in an effort to thwart the Russians from conquering Europe.
Didnt need propaganda to justify nuking the home islands. Aliies wanted them to surrender, they didnt. They got nuked once, and didnt surrender, so they got nuked again. Sure it's also a warning to russia, but japan surrendered, almost unconditionally, which is the goal of war.
With the death and destruction Germany visited on the world, the allied commanders rightfully decided to show them what was in story if they continued.
It totally amazes me how the majority here is able to ignore the reality of what Nazism brought to the world and the price paid to stop it.
Saying so is why I can only reply to comments here once a day. Voat really stands up for free speech until you piss of the National Socialists.
Wow, this is a very interesting thread. I even learned a thing or two. I remember watching a programme with an old British WW2 POW who was in or near Dresden during the bombings. I really felt for the poor bastard. He described seeing women and children being sucked up in the fire vortex, and how because very young children don't have hard bones yet, in the aftermath there was nothing left of the children except for a pile of jelly. The heat literally melted them. Must've been fucking horrendous seeing that.
People REALLY fucking need to quit calling WW II an "Allied" effort.
The Russians did a markable job slowing the Nazi advance in Russia. Although 90% of the entire war material was imported from the US.
The US single handedly and without any meaningful support whatsoever defeated the Japanese in the Pacific Theater.
The US single handedly turned the tide of battle in North Africa and kicked the Germans off the continent - while the pompous British faggot Montgomery pranced around and tried to take credit.
Montgomery was back to COMMAND US (and some British) troops in Operation Market Garden in Europe. The only significant defeat of American forces since Batan.
The US single handedly defeated the Italians and then the Germans in Western Europe. The British supplied LAND from which the US could organize our war effort. The only significant action the British took was their militarily ineffective TERROR raids conducted as night bombing against population centers. Their crude aircraft and navigation could not hit anything smaller than a city. A sprawling steel plant might as well have a deflector shield over it. On a good night 1 bomb in 250 might hit near the stated target. This also happens to be why Americans bombed during the daytime. Even with the 20 year more advanced US technology we were still unable to hit a military target at night.
But yes. Dresden will always stand out as possible the greatest war crime ever committed (and that is coming from someone that doesn't believe there is such a thing as a war crime). But the war was already won. Dresden was the most despicable act since the yankees raped and burned their way across Georgia.
It wasn't the only German city that was fire bombed.
"The Prime Minister said that we hoped to shatter twenty German cities as we had shattered Cologne, Lubeck, Dusseldorf, and so on. More and more aeroplanes and bigger and bigger bombs. M. Stalin had heard of 2-ton bombs. We had now begun to use 4-ton bombs, and this would be continued throughout the winter. If need be, as the war went on, we hoped to shatter almost every dwelling in almost every German city. " (Official transcript of the meeting at the Kremlin between Winston Churchill and Josef Stalin on Wednesday, August 12, 1942, at 7 P.M.)
"The destruction of German cities, the killing of German workers, and the disruption of civilized community life throughout Germany [is the goal]. ... It should be emphasized that the destruction of houses, public utilities, transport and lives; the creation of a refugee problem on an unprecedented scale; and the breakdown of morale both at home and at the battle fronts by fear of extended and intensified bombing are accepted and intended aims of our bombing policy. They are not by-products of attempts to hit factories." -- "Air Marshal Arthur Harris, Commander in Chief, Bomber Commander, British Royal Air Force, October 25, 1943 quoted in Tami Biddle, Rhetoric and Reality in Air Warfare: The Evolution of British and American Ideas about Strategic Bombing, 1914-1945 (Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press, 2002), p. 220.
Is the deliberate mass murder of civilians on a huge scale ever justified? This article does not have an answer for this question. However, it is important to note that this was a very specific goal of England and America in World War II as the quotes above show. Germany and Japan also bombed civilians but the scale of what they did was a tiny fraction of their opponents. More people died in the bombing of Hamburg alone that in the entire German bombing campaign against England. Was the Anglo-American bombing necessary or moral? Many serious military experts feel it was a poor choice in terms of military priorities. What follows is documentation from both sides. http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffma....2/Bombing.htm
Michael Hoffman is one of the worlds' finest researchers. For (((this))), he is persecuted. His books and articles can be found here.
The British fought well in the North Atlantic, the Med, North Africa, and of course in the skies over England. It wasn't that they didn't do shit but that they were led by a complete ass.
Churchill was hailed as one of the great men of the last century but I think he was an absolute disaster who destroyed the British Empire over nothing but his personal stubbornness.
He masterminded the Gallipolli campaign in WW1 which was a disaster.
He masterminded the Dakar effort in WW2 which was an absolute clusterfuck.
I believe he masterminded Dieppe. My grandfather was there, picking up the remnants of that force and bringing them back to the UK and it was a massacre. Only part of the war he never talked about.
He stayed in a senseless war against Germany of course.
He mortgaged Britain's future to the United States so that the USA could then use Britain as an aircraft carrier. We were paying WW2 war loans off until 2006 I think. Our debts then led to the US being able to grab us by the nuts during the Suez Crisis.
He declared war because of Poland, and Poland was occupied at the end of the war.
Dresden is just one of many awful events which can be laid at his door. The narrative about WW2 being sold to Britain is just unbelievable. It was a disaster for all of Europe and Britain didn't win shit. We won the battles but the battles were pointless and wasteful.
The winners are the judeo-communists and judeo-bankers. There were no other winners. Coincidence?
Churchill is said to be jewish. Churchill himself said they were not going after Hitler because of ideology but because of economics. The judeo-bankers will not allow a country to stand without jewish control of its economy.
It is worth replying to clarify I didn't mean the British people, especially those in military service, did not try. As you said their best leaders were fools. Churchill was a singularly wicked man, a founder of the Devos crowd before the crowd had that name.
There is a particularly sordid affair with Churchill and stock margins at the point of the 1929 stock market crash. Nothing to do with England and I can't right now remember the details. But I do recall many laws were broken and unheard of exceptions made to protect him from the consequences of bad stock bets. It is probably worth looking up just for fun.
But yes. The thing the UK lacked above all else was military leaders. The Royal Navy couldn't even managed an evacuation under the undeclared cease fire of Dunkirk. Simple incompetence doesn't fully explain the span of time from 1890 - 1970. The inventors of civilization don't experience 4 generations of abject failure without some external guiding malice.
Briton still had a military class. Which means you didn't hold leadership rank by merit. It was still largely about family, purchased titles, and purchased ranks.
I don't know if that's the case with Montgomery, but I always assumed.
theshopper ago
A real holocaust.
NPCGator ago
Researching this event is one of the things that started me down the rabbit hole of lies we have been told about our history.
ARsandOutdoors ago
Vertigo Politix is based as fuck. And I recommend you download all you can of his and watch. His channel has been taken down twice iirc
Logansrun ago
12 years of government schools and two university degrees and never was what happened to Germany mentioned. Thanks for posting this, I’m sharing it with my family
qwop ago
Thank you.
Creggieb ago
Dont forget the deliberate inclusion of incindinery bombs, as well as regular explosives.
When Tokyo got firebombed, that was tough shit, because the war effort got decentralized, and every home was part of a factory system.
theshopper ago
That sounds like a strait propaganda line of bullshit used to justify dropping atomic bombs in an effort to thwart the Russians from conquering Europe.
Creggieb ago
Didnt need propaganda to justify nuking the home islands. Aliies wanted them to surrender, they didnt. They got nuked once, and didnt surrender, so they got nuked again. Sure it's also a warning to russia, but japan surrendered, almost unconditionally, which is the goal of war.
revised2 ago
With the death and destruction Germany visited on the world, the allied commanders rightfully decided to show them what was in story if they continued.
It totally amazes me how the majority here is able to ignore the reality of what Nazism brought to the world and the price paid to stop it.
Saying so is why I can only reply to comments here once a day. Voat really stands up for free speech until you piss of the National Socialists.
ratsmack ago
Another one the Jews want to keep covered up.
Target_Renegade ago
Wow, this is a very interesting thread. I even learned a thing or two. I remember watching a programme with an old British WW2 POW who was in or near Dresden during the bombings. I really felt for the poor bastard. He described seeing women and children being sucked up in the fire vortex, and how because very young children don't have hard bones yet, in the aftermath there was nothing left of the children except for a pile of jelly. The heat literally melted them. Must've been fucking horrendous seeing that.
B166-ER ago
You should read "The Gruesome Harvest" but do it on am empty stomach.
Target_Renegade ago
Is it a book? Do you have a link?
B166-ER ago
https://archive.org/details/GruesomeHarvestTheAlliedAttemptToExterminateGermanyAfter1945
Phantom42 ago
No. I'm going to eat while reading just to spite you.
boekanier ago
Textbook example of a war crime.
ScannerDarkly ago
Kurt Vonnegut - Armageddon, in Retrospect.
A wonderful novel from a man who was an American POW in Dresden at the time of the bombing.
KLDB ago
IMO, I think these cities were decimated because so much of the architecture didnt follow their historical narrative.
Butterbread ago
But, but wikipedia says Dresden didn't burn and it's an exaggeration by right wing conspiracy nuts...
derram ago
https://www.invidio.us/watch?v=IPIk8_oTI-0 :
This has been an automated message.
Logansrun ago
Thank for posting, you have to have a youtube account to view otherwise.
Giganibba ago
Yes, a disgusting affair. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were also fire bombed. Nukes as we know don't exist. It's a pacifying myth.
KLDB ago
Its trauma based mind control.
acheron2012 ago
ENGLAND!
People REALLY fucking need to quit calling WW II an "Allied" effort.
The Russians did a markable job slowing the Nazi advance in Russia. Although 90% of the entire war material was imported from the US.
The US single handedly and without any meaningful support whatsoever defeated the Japanese in the Pacific Theater.
The US single handedly turned the tide of battle in North Africa and kicked the Germans off the continent - while the pompous British faggot Montgomery pranced around and tried to take credit.
Montgomery was back to COMMAND US (and some British) troops in Operation Market Garden in Europe. The only significant defeat of American forces since Batan.
The US single handedly defeated the Italians and then the Germans in Western Europe. The British supplied LAND from which the US could organize our war effort. The only significant action the British took was their militarily ineffective TERROR raids conducted as night bombing against population centers. Their crude aircraft and navigation could not hit anything smaller than a city. A sprawling steel plant might as well have a deflector shield over it. On a good night 1 bomb in 250 might hit near the stated target. This also happens to be why Americans bombed during the daytime. Even with the 20 year more advanced US technology we were still unable to hit a military target at night.
But yes. Dresden will always stand out as possible the greatest war crime ever committed (and that is coming from someone that doesn't believe there is such a thing as a war crime). But the war was already won. Dresden was the most despicable act since the yankees raped and burned their way across Georgia.
AdValorem ago
It wasn't the only German city that was fire bombed.
"The Prime Minister said that we hoped to shatter twenty German cities as we had shattered Cologne, Lubeck, Dusseldorf, and so on. More and more aeroplanes and bigger and bigger bombs. M. Stalin had heard of 2-ton bombs. We had now begun to use 4-ton bombs, and this would be continued throughout the winter. If need be, as the war went on, we hoped to shatter almost every dwelling in almost every German city. " (Official transcript of the meeting at the Kremlin between Winston Churchill and Josef Stalin on Wednesday, August 12, 1942, at 7 P.M.)
"The destruction of German cities, the killing of German workers, and the disruption of civilized community life throughout Germany [is the goal]. ... It should be emphasized that the destruction of houses, public utilities, transport and lives; the creation of a refugee problem on an unprecedented scale; and the breakdown of morale both at home and at the battle fronts by fear of extended and intensified bombing are accepted and intended aims of our bombing policy. They are not by-products of attempts to hit factories." -- "Air Marshal Arthur Harris, Commander in Chief, Bomber Commander, British Royal Air Force, October 25, 1943 quoted in Tami Biddle, Rhetoric and Reality in Air Warfare: The Evolution of British and American Ideas about Strategic Bombing, 1914-1945 (Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press, 2002), p. 220.
Is the deliberate mass murder of civilians on a huge scale ever justified? This article does not have an answer for this question. However, it is important to note that this was a very specific goal of England and America in World War II as the quotes above show. Germany and Japan also bombed civilians but the scale of what they did was a tiny fraction of their opponents. More people died in the bombing of Hamburg alone that in the entire German bombing campaign against England. Was the Anglo-American bombing necessary or moral? Many serious military experts feel it was a poor choice in terms of military priorities. What follows is documentation from both sides. http://www.worldfuturefund.org/wffma....2/Bombing.htm
Michael Hoffman is one of the worlds' finest researchers. For (((this))), he is persecuted. His books and articles can be found here.
https://revisionistreview.blogspot.com/2017/02/72nd-anniversary-of-slaughter-bombing.html
https://www.veteranstoday.com/2018/02/16/the-allied-holocaust-in-dresden/
Well_Deserved_Brew ago
The British fought well in the North Atlantic, the Med, North Africa, and of course in the skies over England. It wasn't that they didn't do shit but that they were led by a complete ass.
Churchill was hailed as one of the great men of the last century but I think he was an absolute disaster who destroyed the British Empire over nothing but his personal stubbornness.
He masterminded the Gallipolli campaign in WW1 which was a disaster.
He masterminded the Dakar effort in WW2 which was an absolute clusterfuck.
I believe he masterminded Dieppe. My grandfather was there, picking up the remnants of that force and bringing them back to the UK and it was a massacre. Only part of the war he never talked about.
He stayed in a senseless war against Germany of course.
He mortgaged Britain's future to the United States so that the USA could then use Britain as an aircraft carrier. We were paying WW2 war loans off until 2006 I think. Our debts then led to the US being able to grab us by the nuts during the Suez Crisis.
He declared war because of Poland, and Poland was occupied at the end of the war.
Dresden is just one of many awful events which can be laid at his door. The narrative about WW2 being sold to Britain is just unbelievable. It was a disaster for all of Europe and Britain didn't win shit. We won the battles but the battles were pointless and wasteful.
RoundWheel ago
The winners are the judeo-communists and judeo-bankers. There were no other winners. Coincidence?
Churchill is said to be jewish. Churchill himself said they were not going after Hitler because of ideology but because of economics. The judeo-bankers will not allow a country to stand without jewish control of its economy.
Churchill is proved right.
acheron2012 ago
It is worth replying to clarify I didn't mean the British people, especially those in military service, did not try. As you said their best leaders were fools. Churchill was a singularly wicked man, a founder of the Devos crowd before the crowd had that name.
There is a particularly sordid affair with Churchill and stock margins at the point of the 1929 stock market crash. Nothing to do with England and I can't right now remember the details. But I do recall many laws were broken and unheard of exceptions made to protect him from the consequences of bad stock bets. It is probably worth looking up just for fun.
But yes. The thing the UK lacked above all else was military leaders. The Royal Navy couldn't even managed an evacuation under the undeclared cease fire of Dunkirk. Simple incompetence doesn't fully explain the span of time from 1890 - 1970. The inventors of civilization don't experience 4 generations of abject failure without some external guiding malice.
RoundWheel ago
Briton still had a military class. Which means you didn't hold leadership rank by merit. It was still largely about family, purchased titles, and purchased ranks.
I don't know if that's the case with Montgomery, but I always assumed.
RoundWheel ago
Holocaust - whole burnt offering