We're coming up on tax season; let me tell a story of how the Amish earned their right to not pay taxes. (whatever)

submitted ago by alele-opathic

They fought for it. End of story.

If you want a pretty complete synopsis, here's one. Here's a better one, actually written by the Amish, that isn't on the web anymore.

 

TL;DR:

  1. They resolved collectively that they would fight for freedom from taxation, and that this resolve would not be broken by IRS retaliation.
  2. They refused to give the IRS money.
  3. The IRS couldn't do anything about it, as they don't use banks and all transactions are cash.
  4. The IRS attempted to make an example out of Valentine Byler ("kill the chicken to scare the monkeys") and seized/sold his horses during plowing season.
  5. The Amish, mentally prepared an attack of some sort, rallied around Valentine.
  6. The IRS is now on the defense, having lost the moral battleground (bad optics), and the Amish launch a lawsuit intended to reach the Supreme Court and provide an exemption from taxation for everyone who objects to it.
  7. (((Those who pull the strings))) direct congress to defuse this court case by granting a smaller exemption just to the Amish (not by name, but in character, since the latter could open a loophole for those who declare themselves Amish)
  8. The IRS actually announces that they are 'allowing' the Amish not to pay SS taxes, since they don't draw from SS (claiming to be merciful when you've actually lost).

If we rallied around our Irwin Schiffs et al the same way they rallied around their Byler, we could be in the same boat. I honestly think it is masterful how they diffused this threat by associating the image of a 'tax cheat' (i.e. somehow less American and patriotic than you, Idiot P. Taxpayer) to our modern freedom fighters.

 

PS: This 'magic of word reassociation' is probably one of (((their))) most powerful skills. A fantastic analysis is Friedrick Mann's 'Anatomy of Slavespeak', whose site doesn't appear to be on the internet anymore. Here's a pastebin (which strips links) and an archive (which you download and change the extension to a 'html' file to view - links are preserved).

Landwhaleonline ago

The most fundamental question that should be asked is, who gave anyone else the right to tell other humans what they can or cannot do? This may sound like a simple or naive question, but really ask yourself. What valid reason does any human have to justify controlling another human?

Etienne: "He who thus domineers over you has only two eyes, only two hands, only one body, no more than is possessed by the least man among the infinite numbers dwelling in your cities; he has indeed nothing more than the power that you confer upon him to destroy you."

harmlessgryphon ago

3: No, they use banks. I used to work in Amish-land, and it wasn't unusual to see one go into the local bank and walk out with a paper bag. That bag was full of money that was going to be used to purchase something. You are right on the cash thing, it wasn't unusual to see those bags containing >100000 being used to purchase land.

If push came to shove, they would simply withdraw their cash and you'd have a local run on a bank.

alele-opathic ago

3: No, they use banks. I used to work in Amish-land, [...]

Though this may be true now (I don't know myself), both citations at the beginning of my post confirm they were not using banks 60 years ago, when they were actually fighting the IRS.

Conway ago

Or in another words "collectivism".

Harnawe ago

I use bitcoin to buy pretty much everything online. Overstock accepts bitcoin, you can use purse.io for amazon. Most things i want to donate to accept bitcoin. Every now and then theres people i want to support and have to use fiat, but those are hardly necessary if youre a purist. I usually encourage them to accept bitcoin regardless. granted I don't have a lot of money, so its not a lot of risk for me to keep bitcoin.

jokersmild ago

Yeah, that does the same thing.

fr33europe ago

Yeah, I'd argue that by converting to crypto to fiat you're defeating the whole point.

It would be cool to have a crypto that by default is tied to an hour of labour.

fr33europe ago

I'd like to start my own business, and while I understand people won't be lining up to pay in crypto, I would most definitely make payments available in crypto.

Why more people aren't adopting it at this point is beyond me

juicedidwtc ago

brain dead normies can sign up for coinbase in 5 minutes. If that's too centralized for you, try localbitcoins, localbitcoincash, localmonero, etc.

fr33europe ago

It doesn't even hold up in theory. I don't have time in my day to heat up a bowl of soup for lunch, let alone meet some neckbeard to exchange crypto

juicedidwtc ago

do you honestly not know what bitcoin is?

juicedidwtc ago

bitcoin cash

juicedidwtc ago

This only worked because Amish dont participate in any fiat banking system. That's why every goat needs to be behind cryptocurrency 100%. When we become our own banks, they lose their power over us.

prairie ago

Not true, you owe taxes on barter transactions as well, which I'm sure people are good about paying.

ForTheUltimate ago

It's not linear, it's exponential. It doesn't go from 1 to 0.1 and then in a 10th of the time to 0. It goes from 1 to 0.1 to 0.01 to 0.001

check out the rubble re-evaluations kek that things worth like 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000001 of what it used to be worth

ForTheUltimate ago

what's the relationship between the amish and the jews?

GIF-lLL-S0NG ago

It will always have some, non 0 value because it is good toilet paper and also good for starting fires

Haywood_Jablomeme ago

TIL Its a right to not be stolen from

SearchVoatBot ago

This submission was linked from this v/emergencynation submission by @7e62ce85.

Posted automatically (#25690) by the SearchVoat.co Cross-Link Bot. You can suppress these notifications by appending a forward-slash(/) to your Voat link. More information here.

uvb76 ago

They are only exempt from Social Security. They still pay federal income tax and state tax.

alele-opathic ago

They are only exempt from Social Security.

And separate but related taxes, like Medicare.

They still pay federal income tax and state tax.

Though this is true de jure, since they are near-totally off of the banking grid, this is impossible to enforce. I've read that a certain number of them send in nominal amounts anyway, though.

uvb76 ago

It varies from sect to sect. Some have their own credit union and participate in farm leasing for their land. It's unavoidable for those that hold assets and participate in farm based property tax adjustments. Some states will adjust your property taxes based on your Sch F. The IRS is currently testing out a method for auditing farms in New York. Soon to go nationwide. That will change some things if it proves to work.

Any Amish person that has not been accepted into the church is still subject to SS and medicare. Any Amish person who works for a non exempt employer will still have these taxes taken out without being able to get them back even if they have a valid 4029. The worst part about it is when they do get their 4029 approved they are ineligible to use the programs that they paid into. Sometimes the 4029 can take up to a year or more to be approved and until they have the form in hand they are required to pay self employment tax/SS if on a w-2. The only way to get it back is to amend previous years returns once the 4029 is returned stamped and approved and that only works if the income was from self employment.

One of the things that they do that helps them out is their strong in group preference combined with their habit of not talking to the police.

Revelations2_9 ago

Quality post. Thanks OP.

Atomized_Individual ago

We should be pushing for socialist overspending. It's going to happen anyway. Republic of Texas is getting ready. https://www.thenewamerican.com/economy/economics/item/29295-gold-depository-bypassing-federal-reserve-opens-in-texas

alele-opathic ago

what would it take to tell all [group X] to fuck off once and for all and blackball them throughout all banks and employers?

First, you must destroy alternatives. They are slowly talking about introducing regulation for e.g. crypto, which is known in the sales world as 'planting the seed'. Once there are no alternatives, your scenario becomes a very simple matter of execution.

gazillions ago

Execution being the magic word.

It can be the "progressive" 1%' s last words.

Atomized_Individual ago

Socialist overspending will collapse ((( USDollar )))

Corpse_washer ago

So they did it the Roman way. (Fasces)

What a surprise.

BirthTheGirth ago

You can ask your employer to not take out any taxes. The dude in Oregon is getting off the hook due to the fact that he cashed all his checks personally, didnt hide any funds from the IRS. And because he didnt use banks they could not get from his account what they were owed, but due to the fact that he wasnt trying to hide the funds, there is really nothing they can do about it. No taxation without representation. As ive said before, tax money is going to planned parenthood who in turn is funding Democrats. That is illegal. Until my money goes to actual infrastructure, schools, etc. Fuck paying them.

ForTheUltimate ago

due to the fact that he wasnt trying to hide the funds

bullshit. he was just too small game for irs to bother

go1dfish ago

they could not get from his account what they were owed,

What they were attempting to steal you mean.

alele-opathic ago

The dude in Oregon is getting off the hook

Who? I'd love another case study.

You can ask your employer to not take out any taxes.

While true, as someone who has tried this before, they tried to throw the book at me for the 'Gross Underpayment Penalty', which I researched and is basically 'owing' more than $1k at the end of the year. Strategically, they are ultimately trying to get us on the quarterly estimated payments system that the force farmers et.al. to use, by slow herding (e.g. aforementioned penalty).

I forget where I read: 'It all starts with an Information Return".

alele-opathic ago

If taxes were not automatically deducted [...] I'd be willing to bet the amount of people not paying would collapse the IRS in a single year.

This is exactly why they are withheld. It doesn't feel like 'your' money anymore, so you are less inclined to fight to keep it.

Themooninthesky ago

How about a tax revolt? If most of middle class refused to pay the irs workers wound laid off. Times 10 years. Broke.

7e62ce85 ago

Are you willing to give up your benefits? That was part of the story.

Themooninthesky ago

Haha. What benefits? Social security? Medicare?

ForTheUltimate ago

everything/ the fire department too nigger faggot. If you want something, go and buy it.

prairie ago

The IRS doesn't collect sales tax.

7e62ce85 ago

Yes.

alele-opathic ago

How about a tax revolt?

I've studied how the TEA Party and Occupy revolts were diffused; I'd love such a scenario, but it'd be a stretch to get everyone on the same page.

Atomized_Individual ago

Socialist overspending on top of the growing $22 Trillion debt will collapse ((( USDollar ))) and therefore [DC/Deep State]

Themooninthesky ago

It’s so easy, you don’t have to do anything! Literally.

tzitzit ago

Isn't that funny?

ForTheUltimate ago

reap the benefits of paying less tax whilst the faggot beat cucks payup