My guess is probably a lot given those wooden doors.
I don't see why this isn't a reasonable question for a chem exam. Maybe you chem guys can give us some insight. Here's the backstory and the question itself:
A chemistry professor whose exam question asked students to calculate the lethal dose of a poisonous gas used in Nazi gas chambers during the Holocaust has taken a leave of absence. Middlebury College in Vermont said that it's investigating under the terms of its faculty misconduct policy.
'This inexplicable failure of judgment trivializes one of the most horrific events in world history, violates core institutional values, and simply has no place on our campus,' wrote Middlebury President Laurie Patton last week. 'We expect our faculty to teach and lead with thoughtfulness, good judgment, and maturity. To say we have fallen short in this instance is an understatement.'
The question posed by Byers asked students to calculate how much poison it would take for them to create a lethal dose of hydrogen cyanide, the deadly chemical mixture used on Jewish people in the Nazi gas chambers during the Holocaust. 'Hydrogen cyanide is a poisonous gas, which Nazi Germany used to horrific ends during The Holocaust,' Byers wrote, according to Middlebury Campus.
'The lethal dose for humans is approximately 300. mg of HCN gas per kilogram of air when inhaled... If a room measured [redacted] ft. what mass of air would it have in g if the density fo the air [redacted] [Celsius] (room temperature) is [redacted]?' The exam also instructed students to, 'Calculate the g of HCN that would give a lethal dose in the above room.'
Archived Daily Fail article
Non-archivable local Faux News article
Archived CBS Jews article
Zyklon B was more expensive to make than crating in a more pure form of hydrogen cyanide(s). And even hydrogen cyanide in pellet form is not something anyone would legitmately try and genocide a group of people with. If you want to kill a bunch of people quick and easy, displace oxygen in the tanks. No unnecessary, messy, hazardous chemicals involved.Llet's not pretend like Germans weren't the world leaders in engineering at the time.
You know, if i were a "nasty nazi" looking for efficiency solutions for my freedom labor camp, I would probably experiment with delousing entire groups of people at one go - so, I would like to know the lethal dosage of this delousing agent so that I can be sure not to exceed it. I don't want to kill off my labor but I do want to kill the lice they carry.
Honestly, the whole gas thing is so stupid and makes no sense. There are much simpler and cheaper ways to kill people. I can't believe people still believe this nonsense.
But you guys are the experts, can you calculate this for us? Or give us even a rough estimate?
Kalergi ago
An easier way to off the cowards would be to hide a few shekels on one and let the remainder sniff it out and tear him apart. wash, rinse , repeat.
FoundingUncle ago
I was taught as a child that the inmates removed the doors once they were freed (to prevenet them being used) even before the allied troops arroved. Allied troops put wooden doors on to.keep.PTSD-Adler.inmayes from crawlimg inside the ovens and freaking out.
ENDtheirBLOODLINE ago
Never forget the six million lice Zyklon B killed.
Boax ago
Oy vey, that’s antisemetic goy!
Zoldam ago
Was Zyklon B not similar to DDT? I know with DDT it's unhealthy as fuck, but you are not going to die on the spot from it.
glennvtx ago
It doesn't take very much at all, a single can was well over the amount necessary. All your mental gymnastics to cast doubt on this story are severely flawed, but if you are so certain please try the experiment on yourself. I
shadow332 ago
You're boring. Fuck you and the holohoax.
KILLtheRATS ago
I always understood z-b take 15 hour exposure in a hermetically sealed room to kill a person
Goys-R-Us ago
@zyklon_b, we need expert testimony.
zyklon_b ago
it would take 6 tons to gas a big room
theoldguy ago
You'd better start eating that Taco Bell stuff now, son!
zyklon_b ago
Why taco bell?
theoldguy ago
I was just remembering a local store a few years ago where the mural said "GET CHEAP GAS HERE!"
zyklon_b ago
sounds affordable
Tzitzimitl ago
oy vey
Buzzzard ago
Claiming that the Germans used Zyklon-B to gaz 6 billion jews is simply another example of jewish block-headedness. Zyklon-B is an insecticide and fumigant. The Germans had extremely effective and lethal poison gases such as sarin and tabun that they would have used IF they had actually killed jews en masse. Oy!
speedisavirus ago
Retard. 70 mg respirated. And if it's what you have it's what you use. A single breathe is more than that.
midnightblue1335 ago
This is rarely brought up. Genocides and mass killings are frequent throughout history. In the time of the alleged holocaust, using bayonets, hangings, or mass firing squads would make the most sense. Forced death marches worked for the Turks against the Armenians, but that might not have been feasible in WW2 Europe.
jewd_law ago
the jewish bolsheviks had already proven you could kill 10 of millions of White Christian Russians and Eastern Europeans by just starving them and executing them - and they weren't near as mechanically/scientifically proficient as the Germans. So why would the Reich do something as stupid as use a delousing agent to do the job? Only a kike would have the chutzpah to make up such an outrageous claim.
BlackSheepBrouhaha ago
Also, the country which invented easily (and often accidentally) concocted Mustard Gas instead chose to use a proprietary delousing agent to gas people to death?
Totenkopf1945 ago
if you want to kill them just dont feed or water them and leave them exposed to the elements. Worked for the US in the Rhine meadows death camps after the war
Charilko ago
The argument I always heard was “it was emotionally difficult for German soldiers to shoot large groups of people.” I have no doubt that such a thing is true on its own. However, don’t they also accuse those same German soldiers of making lampshades out of human skin? A bit of a contradiction there.
undertheshills ago
Bolshevik jews had the best genocide program. Just make being in possession of and travel food illegal
Zoldam ago
I always say this. A bullet in the 40s cost a little less than 10 cents, and is much quicker and much more effective.
chirogonemd ago
I usually don't even go near the chemical arguments at all. When you consider the stakes for Germany economically in WWII and the fact they were at war with the world's superpowers on multiple fronts both land and air, it's so cosmically ignorant to suppose that Hitler would enact a plan to genocide a people by loading them onto trains to concentrate them locally, killing them in an expensive and inefficient theatrical way, just to then expose of the bodies in an even more expensive and inefficient way.
It is senseless.
When one has the goal of murdering millions of people, humans have already figured out the most economical way of approaching genocide: bullets. You march through where they are, and you shoot them.
u_r_wat_u_eat ago
Makes about as much sense as rollercoasters of death and death by masturbation machines
B3bomber ago
Pfft. They were locked in prisons (concentration camps). They had a problem with typhus outbreaks killing them and the guards. There's official documentation where the leaders of the camps had to lower the death rates. Guards had guns with bullets...
Also, cheapest killing in that sense is simply stop giving them food and water.
stric9 ago
It's not important. What is importent Is why are you asking the question? Need to justify something? They know.
shadow332 ago
Of course it is.
because people need to be shown that they have been lied to for decades by kikes and their fairy tale bullshit story.
Yes, we need to justify why Israel should have no more funding or backing from the US. No more money pumped into their wallets using the holohoax industry.
No they don't. They are teaching fucking holohoax classes in school. People need to understand questioning just even little, reveals a big big lie.
Livelongdiefree ago
I will back this up, in high school it was a constant bullshit of this Nazi bad, jews good. Was forced to go through the Holocaust Museum for a school trip, ran from end to end. Looking down, took me a few minutes. They were mad lol!
thelma ago
http://www.molbase.com/en/sds_74-90-8-moldata-144848.html#tabs
Depends on many factors...the lethality of the substance is well known ^^ a safety data sheet
Get out your paper and pencil !
BeauDacious ago
Something is wrong with that version of an MSDS (bold text mine to highlight error)
section 9:
Section 12
snafu ago
Cyanide is polar, so it should be highly soluble in water due to hydrogen bonding iirc correctly.
Eualos ago
Bingo
EdSnowden ago
10x10x10 room for ease of calculation is 1,000 cubic feet
1,000 cubic feet of air is approximately 36.68 kilos in weight.
300mg/kilo breathed air lethal dose means you’d need just over 11,000mg, or 11g of zyklon b.
ChaoticNeutral ago
Your math is wrong. A lethal dose isn’t measured against the mass of the air in the room. It’s the mass of the person. I redid the math the way a chemist would do it, since I am one.
Molar mass HCN: 27.011 g/mol
270 ppm instantly fatal dose
Room size: 10 ft^3 -> 3.048 m^3 -> 28,350 L
Berlin weather today:
21.11 C -> 294.26 K
30.41 inHg -> 1.016 atm
Ideal gas constant 0.0821 (Latm)/(molK)
(PV)/(RT) = n
(1.01628,350)/(0.0821294.26) = n mols = 1,192.25 mols
N = 1,192.25 mols * 6.022 molecules/mol = 7.1797 E 26 molecules
ppm = 7.1797 E 26 molecules * 27 E-6 molecules = 1.9385 E 22 molecules HCN
1.9385 E 22 molecules HCN / 6.023 E 23 molecules per mol = 3.2 E -2 mols
3.2 E -2 mols * 27.011 g/mol = 0.8695 g = 869 mg
TL: DR 869 mg of HCN in a room 10 ft cubed room would instantly kill everyone inside it.
CaucasianSlavery ago
Much respect for becoming a chemist. How the hell did they ever figure out the periodic chart? It seems an impossible task to the laymen. Not expecting an answer if it’s as complicated as it appears.
andrew_jackson ago
The periodic table is just like organizing your cards, when you play a card game. If you have three of a kind and then two of a kind (e.g. full house) you probably shuffle them into order. That's the periodic table in a nutshell. Most people teach it wrong.
CaucasianSlavery ago
How do I learn more about this?
andrew_jackson ago
Remind me tomorrow, and I'll put together a tutorial for you.
CaucasianSlavery ago
Good morning fine sir. Happy Easter :)
andrew_jackson ago
Thanks. How is this? https://voat.co/v/networksecurity/3173486
Do you think I left out anything?
CaucasianSlavery ago
Ok this is going to take me some time, I am very thankful and will give it its due attention.
ChaoticNeutral ago
The history of the table is actually super interesting. Did you know that the layout we use is only one of many versions that was created? It’s worth looking up.
As far as discovery of each element, those are interesting too. They were done by many people over many years using many methods. The Royal Society of Chemistry has a great periodic table app that has a snippet about how each element was discovered. If you’re interested I would say download it.
CaucasianSlavery ago
Im getting the app. Much appreciated!
thelma ago
What if the temperature was at 100F and the pressure was at 1.05 atm ?
Oh boy, just drown them. Math is hard. LOL
Water is cheap.
ChaoticNeutral ago
True drowning would be super easy but you generate the gas on the fly. Look at how old gas chambers used to work. They’d drop a solid into a container of water to generate the lethal gas. Also, who gets to retrieve the dead, shit and piss covered, bodies from the pool for the next batch?
Mass killing is messy as hell.
thelma ago
Do on a beach, let the currents take them away ! Bye bye
EdSnowden ago
Throw them into a volcano
KaijuAgenda ago
Send them to mexico
thelma ago
Another good option.
Eualos ago
The orders of magnitude are similar. Are you sure this isn't just a sig fig issue since you used much more exact numbers?
ChaoticNeutral ago
It is partly, but they also assumed a single lethal dose. At that concentration a single breath would kill you instantly, and everyone else in the room who was breathing.
KILLtheRATS ago
We also need to figure out how long it takes to become toxic to people. I always understood it was 15 hours
snafu ago
Just commenting from a biological perspective, but HCN kills pretty quickly (within minutes). The reason is because of how it works. Basically, Cyanide works by inhibiting an enzyme called Cytochrome C, which is required to produce ATP (the main energy molecule used by cells) in the mitochondria (the power center of the cell). If you ingest cyanide, the molecule has to travel through the body (which dilutes it) and basically causes damage everywhere. If you breathe it however, the cyanide does enter the blood stream and does cause non-specific damage, but it mainly kills the lung cells. As the lung cells start dying you suffocate, which is mainly how it kills in gas form. That is much more efficient as you need a lot less as you have the dilution effect like when you ingest it.
KILLtheRATS ago
Is the concentration of cyanide in z-d enough to work as fast at pure cyanide? If it was only a portion, would it not take time to build up in the bodies. I was also told that the concentration need for death could not occur without hermetically sealed doors and a specific humidity. Can you speak on this? Also what is the lifespan of cyanide on concrete? Could it not be tested?
snafu ago
Just to clarify, I'm only talking about this from a chemistry/industrial process perspective, not anything else. I'm just going to share my knowledge without stating any opinion, and this is more relevant to anyone that works in a lab or does any kind of industrial chemistry as a lot of processes can produce toxic gas and you might not even know it until it's too late. With that said, I'm no expert (just have some background in it, but it's not my career) so if anyone actually does this for a living and I'm wrong about something please chime in.
Basically, as I understand it, z-d doesn't contain cyanide, rather it evolves (chemistry term, not the biological term) HCN (cyanide gas) when exposed to something (water? I forget). HCN is then breathed in, and in the body the hydrogen is stripped (which it's an acidic proton, so it happens readily) and turns into CN- (actual cyanide). @ChaoticNeutral 's calculation is actually an overestimation as his calculation is based on the amount of z-d that would be needed to cause a high enough concentration of CN- in the body to be a lethal dose. However, that's not how HCN kills. You have to remember that you're breathing it in and it kills your lung cells very fast, so you die from suffocation long before there is enough in your body to constitute a lethal dose. The concentration in the air that's needed is going to be much smaller because of how quickly destroys your lungs. I can't say what concentration is needed, but the calculation above is an upper bound, and in practice the amount needed is going to be much lower (the 9g calculated above is already a very tiny amount).
With regards to the doors, that's not really true (again from a chemistry perspective). Without active ventilation it's definitely possible to build up enough gas (of any type) to cause death as even if it's not sealed as there isn't going to be enough air flow to remove the gas. Gas diffusion is relatively slow, and would be much slower than the rate of HCN production (meaning the concentration will increase). In a lab, you'd have something called a 'hood', which is basically a box with an opening, but inside the box is a vacuum pump that actively sucks in air and puts in through a filter. This causes a negative pressure so air flows into the hood, and the chemist is protected from any gaseous byproducts as the box is actively ventilated. If that pump is off (and the hood is open) it's definitely possible to be harmed/killed by any toxic byproducts.
With regards to the lifespan of CN-, I don't have any numbers, but if I remember my chemistry correctly it should have a very low lifespan because it should be really reactive. CN- is two free electrons on a Carbon, which is triple bonded with a Nitrogen. Two electrons on a Carbon is called a Carboanion, which iirc are very very reactive. Basically they want to bind to anything they can, and would quickly be undetectable.
ChaoticNeutral ago
I do agree with everything you’ve stated. I was doing the calculation off of the instantly lethal inhalation dose listed in the SDS. Which means one breath should be lethal. I assume that it is much higher than the body tissue dose necessary to be lethal. People hear 9 grams and think ‘that’s so much’. Nope, not really. Also, Lewis, as in “Lewis acids and bases” was killed by cracked glassware while using HCN in a reaction.
You are also correct on the lifetime of CN-. It is a very reactive species.
peacegnome ago
that's 11g of HCN, then comes the chemistry
B3bomber ago
Need to mention the volume of gas 11g of HCN would take up (at room temp). It's density compared to the common atmospheric mix is another bit of info (does it rise, sink, or actually diffuse evenly?).
Eualos ago
At very low concentrations with circulation it should diffusion largely evenly, but after a certain point it will sink . 687 kg/m³ is its density. Air is 1.2041 kg/m3.
swolegoy ago
If the density of HCN gas is lower than that of air it will eventually rise and the air will sink.
Eualos ago
It's not, I fixed that period at the end of that sentence. It's much denser than air.
swolegoy ago
Check this here. I'm not sure why they say HCN is lighter than air when it is clearly not when comparing densities.
https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/mhmi/mmg8.pdf
Eualos ago
They say it is with a source because they didn't bother verifying it probably.
EdSnowden ago
Ahh cool thanks
shadow332 ago
You want to see even funnier answers check out quora: https://www.quora.com/How-deadly-is-Zyklon-B
KDs_Other_Burner ago
The Soviets used gassing vans.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_van
If the Germans had been predisposed to killing kikes they would have used these.
CaucasianSlavery ago
By soviets you mean bolsheviks by which you mean the Jews that cohabited (exploited) with the Ukrainians in southwest Russia for ages. That gas van was engineered by Jews and they knew gassing worked that’s why it was in their imagination when they pretended it happened to them. Funny, I wonder if carbon monoxide is cheaper than zyklon b?
Charlez6 ago
Hmmmmmmmmm
CaucasianSlavery ago
They knew from the Torah that killing the first born son is effective, so it was the most likely punishment is you came up short or complained.
18133027? ago
How much would you charge @Zyklon_B?
zyklon_b ago
bout tree fiddy
andrew_jackson ago
1990!
thelma ago
Companies still sell it...call them up. Likely depends on qty.
Give discounts to kill larger number of jews.
18133426? ago
Happy Easter weekend
TradMan ago
Are you a woman?
18134034? ago
No? That's an odd response to my comment
TradMan ago
Couldn't agree more. 😆
Just seemed like something I imagine my future wife would say.
18134571? ago
Oh get @Thelma she's single
thelma ago
Thelma would not take a mate that did not already know the answers to the posed questions in this thread.