Introducing the 24 Hour Removal Reprieve Flair
A lot of people who care about this sub have had many conversations over the past few months about what can be done to make it run smoothly despite the many difficulties we face. We need submission rules to fight the forum-slider shitposts. We have to administer them consistently to avoid censorship. But many users struggle to craft posts that satisfy them, especially while dealing with anger, frustration and resentment toward mods for removing. We need moderator authority decentralized, yet still effective...Last night, many of those conversations gelled in my brain in a new idea, and @think- and I would like to try it. Here's how it will work:
- Instead of immediately removing posts that fail to meet the submission rules, we will flair them with a 24-hour removal warning, and leave a comment requesting an edit about which rule(s) are at issue. The imperfect post will remain on the board for 24 hours, with the flair.
- The flair will alert all other users that the post is in danger of being removed -- so they can help the OP fix it by supplying links, clarifying the PG connection, explaining things with clearer logic or whatever is missing
- At the end of that time, the post will be automatically removed -- unless the OP responds to the mod comment (not a DM or modmail) to let us know he has edited it and wants the flair removed.
- At that point, mods will reevaluate and either remove the flair, request additional edits, or remove the post
- To avoid a spam tsunami of shitposts, users will only be allowed to have two such flaired threads on the board. Continuing to post threads after you've been flaired for removal will cause you to forfeit the 24 Hour Removal Reprieve. The posts will be removed and the user banned for repeated disregard of the subverse submission rules.
Pros: No more crushing instant deletions and laborious copy-paste resubmissions. All users get the opportunity to moderate the subverse content. Moderators get the opportunity to clearly see community sentiment toward the relevance and value of the subject matter.
Cons: Shitposts stay on the board overnight. (Where they can be downvoated soundly, accruing negative SCP and exposing their purveyors to the appreciation of the community. Ahem. Perhaps this is not a negative!).
The beauty of this approach is that it radically shifts the burden to the users themselves.
Right now, the mods are always the bad guys, with heavy pressure from above* if things aren't removed immediately that violate the rules, and heavy pressure from users if things are summarily removed. Our ruleset is somewhat contrary to the freewheeling expression beloved by Voat at large. Your average Old Goat coming in here to contribute something they think we might be interested in, and getting removed for rule-breaking, is usually shocked, and often complains to ProtectVoat. Understandably.
*Also understandably, because of that anti-rule culture clash, @kevdude @Crensch @VictorSteinerDavion must ensure mods aren't abusing the rules. (Hence the downward pressure lest we mods make the rules look bad). Mods get caught in the middle, and so almost no one wants to take their turn playing dog catcher. Mods are stretched thin and make poorer decisions. The beauty of the 24-hour-flair is it involves the whole community and the user in "Removals" by giving everyone the power to prevent them.
So starting immediately, we are going to try this. Please leave your feedback, ideas, etc. here in the comments, and get involved when you see the new flair and try your hand at modding.
Special thanks to @Disappointed for encouraging new ways of doing things.
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ESOTERICshade ago
One shill could totally take over the front page using about five alts. At two slides per alt name that is ten slides. I don't see any procedure for avoiding this in place.
Vindicator ago
Downvoting
GreenDell144 ago
What if a poster is limited to one per day? I have two kids, work full time and I have fair to middling computer skills. This means, I don’t post much, but I’m often finding two minute breaks to look at things and try to make helpful comments. I know there are great researchers and even likely some professional investigators, would they be severely inhibited the if they could only do one post in a 24 hour period?
Vindicator ago
It's not that the number of posts an OP can make will be limited, but the number of posts flaired for rule-breaking. One of the things the shills do is post several crappy, partly or unsourced threads full of disinfo at once (use searchvoat.co and look up posts made here by any username in the ban log that were deleted and you'll see) to slide content off the board. A new legit user might make a couple of submissions without understanding the rules (which don't show up on mobile unless you view the desktop version of the site), and I believe we should give these a chance. But not more than two rule-breakers at a time.
ESOTERICshade ago
I don't know why. 24 hours is a long time. What is your answer to the following not happening? Shills work day and night. If they want to they can keep you jammed. What can you do about the following?
Vindicator ago
If it's obvious shitposts in the order of the old PGisStupid spam that is actually burying quality content, we could remove it. That hasn't happened in very, very long time, though.
What do YOU see as a solution?
ESOTERICshade ago
Good. I just wanted to know that obvious shit posts won't get the flair, but only people really trying in good faith. Carry on my good man :)