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Votescam ago

Thank you for letting us know about this movie ... There's a lot of course that's not said ...
like the suggestion that this went on for 35 years. I'd like to know her view on that -- and his.

Does the movie every address anything that is know about what he is thinking during this time? Whether he's a pedophile which seems to be the case? And what Mrs. G has to do with all of this.

It took me back to my early years and what I was thinking and feeling about human sexuality. Males I knew. One I'd had a crush on since I was 5 or 6 years old. But that was a crush - not anything like what happens in this movie.

I always had an awareness, however, of the threat of being raped -- sexually abused. My Mother had related a story to me of an older man trying to fondle her when she was young. A neighbor. Later, when I was 6 or so, playing on the NY streets one even just before we were all being called in for dinner, a male approached me and asked if I'd read him the address on a mail box. It was a small open lobby so I wasn't concerned as we were basically still visible from the street. But then when I couldn't read it, he picked me up and I didn't like where his hand landed. I wiggled out and on home. A little difference in timing, a little difference in dusk being darkness. Fewer children on the street still who would have heard me call ... and who knows what might have happened. There are other stories I've long been thinking about.

Since the review is very optimistic on the way the story was presented, I'll take that as fact and will try to see it. Also I'm a fan of Ellyn Burstyn and her acting/movies.

Piscina ago

It's not odd that the *relationship went on into her teen years. That's the mindfuck that is grooming and child abuse...you think you're complicit. That's why you feel shame. Some part of you tells you it's fucked but he's bound you to him and you think it's love.

Votescam ago

Piscina --

A PEDOPHILE is interested in children of specific ages -- Pedophilia is all about the AGE of the child ...

There are different names for those who are interested in a 4 year old -- and different names for those interested in a 8-9 year old ... and other names for pedophiles interested in teenagers who are still minors....

And THIS relationship went on for thirty five years ... !!!

What I'm saying is that this case is quite different from what we're discussing here .. child trafficking and MKULTRA ...

Torture of children, as well.

I agree that this kind of rape and sexual abuse does exist -- but it doesn't have a lot in common with the stories the public is more familiar with -- and the stories we deal with here.

However, on the level of the trauma and PTSD that all victims of sexual abuse/rape suffer it is what they all suffer. And, sadly, it is life long. I do think that being able to tell the story also helps, especially when they are believed.

scarlettm512 ago

No, the relationship did NOT go on for 35 years. It merely took her 35 years to get to a point where she was willing to look honestly at what happened to her when she was 13 years old and he was 40.

My problem with this movie is that if the woman was able to be fine with what happened for all those years -- some will argue that the relationship didn't actually harm her. It was the REACTION to the relationship that was harmful. That is EXACTLY what pedos are trying to push. They believe that sex with kids isn't harmful as long as adults don't "over react" to it. Which is total bullshit. This movie is designed to purposely blur the lines in cases like these (which are the majority of child sexual abuse cases -- but certainly not the most extreme ones).

It seems impossible that pedophilia could ever become normalized, but then I take a look at New York and realize that they recognize 31 (yes, THIRTY-ONE) different "genders", some of which are fluid which means it could change daily/hourly, and I realize that making pedophilia mainstream may not be as impossible as I thought. That is terrifying!

Votescam ago

scarlett --

Thank you -- I see that now ... I've re-read it ... and not sure where I got that idea ... somehow the 35 years and "relationship" seemed to stay together in my mind. Again -- thanks!

I haven't seen the movie ... so I have no idea what she did with the trauma... many victims (See: CIA's MKULTRA) "disassociate" which means they develop another personality which is unknown to the host to carry the trauma. However, I think if that had happened it would have been mentioned.

Still there are many stories where this stuff stays buried -- especially when victims are very young. However, the mind will eventually begin to try to straighten things out ... usually by moving the info into the conscious mind in flash-backs.

This man was a pedophile ... but we don't know enough about him to know if he was a heterosexual male.

This buried trauma is always harmful to the victims, sometimes showing up in other failed relationships, sometimes with abuse of alcohol or drugs.

Sex with a child is a CRIME ... and it will never be anything different ... because a child cannot grant "consent."

As I've said, I haven't seen the movie ... if I do I'll comment further on what I think of it.

True pedophiles are thought to have NO sexual orientation.

Males are our sexual abusers of children ... and 95% of them are heterosexual males involved in pedophile activity. This is called "situational pedophilia."

I think your last paragraph suggests that you're being loaded up with nonsense by right wingers ... There are very few cases of trans-gender for anyone to worry about. I applaud Bradley/Chelsea Manning because of what he did in releasing information the public needed to know and be aware of being committed by our US government. There was a character named "Jazz" appearing on one of the networks for a while ... very sad in the choices she was going to have to make in order to become female. Fortunately, she had full backing and understanding from her family.

What truly worries me about our bathrooms is how filthy the men's rooms are ... Many men don't even want to use them. Keep ALL males out of women's bathrooms!! :)

scarlettm512 ago

I'm actually a liberal, not a right winger. I wasn't trying to imply that pedophiles are transgender. I'm sorry if I worded it poorly and it came across that way. I just meant that the very idea that there could even be 31 genders is, frankly, ridiculous and if we can get to a point where we've gone way past acceptance of someone who is transgender to the idea that we can allow individuals to make up their own categories of gender (without some hard scientific evidence to back up those new gender definitions), then all bets are off. I have no problem with people who are transgender living their life as they choose. And I do know that most pedophiles identify as heterosexuals (although I would argue that those men molesting young boys and who still claim to be heterosexual are not being completely honest with themselves about their sexual preferences). And, sadly, while it may be primarily men who sexually abuse children, that is changing as more women are now engaging in these types of behaviors themselves -- in addition to supplying their children to other adults. But, again, I didn't mean to make any disparaging remarks about transgender people -- merely the trend of thinking that being liberal means that you have to accept any and everyone's self designation of gender. Maybe there really are 31 different genders, but I'd like to see the scientific data to back that up before we pass laws to prevent people from asking for proof of gender or impose punishments for not using the pronoun of that person's choice (especially when the concept of gender fluidity is added and you may not know -- unless they are literally wearing a sign that tells you what gender/pronouns apply today -- exactly how you should address them). That was my only point with that last paragraph. Just thought I should clear that up :)

Votescam ago

I didn't think you were suggesting that pedophiles were transgender ... I was pointing out to you the NOISE by the right wing in reaction to transgender issue rising. That it's "much ado about nothing" given the numbers. And given the "bathroom" issue. Have you ever had to use a man's bathroom -- ??!! So worrying about 31 genders is even more inane.

And, your comments here are confused ....

And I do know that most pedophiles identify as heterosexuals (although I would argue that those men molesting young boys and who still claim to be heterosexual are not being completely honest with themselves about their sexual preferences). And, sadly, while it may be primarily men who sexually abuse children, that is changing as more women are now engaging in these types of behaviors themselves -- in addition to supplying their children to other adults.

Pedophiles are thought to have NO sexual orientation...they have "preferences" however for children whether male or female - and very specific preferences as to eye control, etc. When the child moves out of the age group they are attracted to they are no longer interested in them. Pedophilia is based on AGE ... not gender.

However, 95% of those males who sexually abuse children are called "situational" heterosexuals ... In other words they are men who generally desire sex with adult women... but when one isn't available they will sexually abuse a child - any child.

And you continue to be hung up on the idea that if a male sexually abuses a male child then he is a homosexual. No; it doesn't work that way. Anyone who sexually assaults a child is a pedophile. There are two categories of pedophiles -- those with NO sexual orientation and the majority (95%) who are heterosexual.

Women are NOT our sexual abusers of children .... UNLESS they are under the influence of a heterosexual male which is often the case. The female may have previously been sexually abused by a male. Look at Catholic nuns: Many of them have sexually abused children, but they are under the influence of a male-supremacist religion and under its control. And, 40% of Catholic nuns have been beaten and/or sexually abused by Catholic priests.

LINKS ...

Being liberal does NOT mean that you have to accept any and everyone's self-designation of gender."

And what you are saying is quite logical.

What is happening on this issue is that homophobia which is still very alive in our patriarchal societies causes confusion in regard to understanding pedophilia.

We also see a lot of right wing involvement in this issue -- as in late term abortion -- to distort facts and to keep the right wing in "raw meat." These are very MINOR issues as late term abortion is. Late term abortions are necessary because these are pregnancies -- wanted pregnancies -- which go wrong and the pregnancy is effecting the life or health of the pregnant female. These are a very small number of abortions every year in the US ... about ONE in every county of the US every year.

These pregnancies -- again, wanted pregnancies -- can do great harm to a woman's life and health. EVEN prevent her from having future children if she is forced to continue on with the pregnancy -- or forced to a natural birth.

Many people discussing this issue don't realize that there was a time when ALL late term abortions were banned. For instance, Debbie Reynolds/actress was pregnant at one time with a pregnancy gone wrong. The child was dead in her womb. It was affecting her health both mentally and physically, but she was not allowed to abort the dead child. She was forced to carry the dead child in her womb for months before it was delivered naturally.

Some time after that she became pregnant again -- and even earlier the child again died in her womb. She was forced again for even longer to carry the dead child to term.

Eventually, they figured out that she had lost the second child because her system was so depleted from carrying the first dead child to term. In other words, it had seriously effected her health.

These are the kinds of "late term abortion" which the right wing makes so much NOISE about... and tries to excite their right wing followers about. The NOISE is intended to prevent citizens from understanding what these abortions are really about and how FEW of these abortions take place.

That's what I'm saying to you about the transgender issue -- it's a very MINOR issue as to numbers.

And, again -- the bigger "bathroom issue" is the filth of men's rooms.

scarlettm512 ago

I don't know if "hung up" is the right way to phrase it, but I just can't seem to reconcile that someone who claims to be heterosexual and who exclusively molests young boys is truly simply a heterosexual. Of course, the prepubescent bodies of girls and boys are not very different, aside from genitalia, so perhaps the attraction is merely to that body structure and not necessarily the genitals. Although, it is still hard to imagine that someone who prefers that undeveloped body type could possibly be interested in an adult body type, too. But, mental illness doesn't really have any limitations, I suppose.

As for women abusing kids, men are by far the majority of the abusers. However, there is evidence that more women are engaging in this type of behavior. When I was a kid (a long time ago), it was almost unheard of for a woman to be sexually abusing kids -- but now we see many teachers, baby sitters, etc. being convicted of this type of behavior. Some of it may not fall into the category of pedophilia (because they are post-pubescent), but they are certainly taking advantage of authority positions and engaging in inappropriate behavior with children. In my city, there are quite a few women who are on the sex offender registry for sex crimes against minors. But there are even more women who provide their children knowingly to significant others or to strangers for profit. Even if they are under the influence of a male, that doesn't absolve them from their part in the crime. Neither does being abused as a child themselves. I was sexually abused as a child and I would NEVER have any inappropriate relationships, sexual or otherwise, with a child. Never.

Yes, homophobia is real and there are many people who assume that a homosexual will also be a pedophile. But, it is just as wrong to assume that a homosexual cannot be a pedophile, too. Some of them undoubtedly are because it appears that the percentage of pedophiles is pretty consistent -- even across every type of demographic. You can't say it is simply a heterosexual or caucasian or male or lower income problem. It is pretty much a problem in every community. People like Kevin Spacey who defend himself against a claim of sexual assault where the victim was a minor do not help that by deciding that is the perfect time to come out as a gay man.

Personally I am inclined to think that a large percentage of what we call pedophiles are truly sociopathic narcissists. They are interested only in sexual gratification for themselves. Children tend to be favored by them because they will be more compliant and are easier to manipulate and dominate than a peer would be. They would probably be more accurately labeled as pansexual, though, if they have no preference for sexual partners, wouldn't they? Those who are only sexually attracted to children, I view as strictly pedophiles. And I do think that if you have a preference for one gender -- regardless of the age -- that is still significant. I think people are understandably concerned about linking pedophiles to homosexuality, but it seems a little silly not to call a man who is only attracted to underage boys a homosexual pedophile just as a man who is only attracted to underage girls would be a heterosexual pedophile. The problem is that homosexual pedophilia is seen as somehow worse because it is homosexual. That is often why it gets reported more and prosecuted more because parents are more likely to press charges in that case. Pedophilia is pedophilia, though. I don't think it matters whether the person who is targeting a child is gay/straight/bi/pansexual/whatever. The problem isn't in their preferences for genitalia -- it is, as you said, the age preference that makes it horrible. As long as people are consenting adults, I absolutely do not care what they do in private. I may not agree with their choices (like polyamory, for example) but it is their right to live their lives as they see fit. If it involves people who can't consent (like someone who isn't conscious or someone mentally challenged or kids) or animals, though, those people need to be separated from society and only released if rehabilitation can be achieved.

Votescam ago

Scarlet --

Wow ... you just continue to confuse yourself. If you truly want to know about pedophiles and "situational" pedophiles who are heterosexuals then go to basic articles -- not right wing or anti-abortion websites and read about the studies. What I see over and again here is the FEAR that right wing instills in those they brainwash about reading anything that might help them figure anything out -- or enable them to think for themselves.

One of the things you miss about human sexuality is that really it takes place in the BRAIN... that's why transgender suffer as they do. The BRAIN is out of sync with the body.

Pedophiles are very specifically attracted to children of a specific AGE. Some very young children, some older children.

As for women abusing kids, men are by far the majority of the abusers. However, there is evidence that more women are engaging in this type of behavior.

Can you shoot me a link on what evidence you saw in that regard ...

Yes, you see more pictures of women on Yahoo -- as we just saw with the tortured children. Wasn't until like day 4 or 5 that they let it be known that there was a husband in the household.

True -- even if a heterosexual is involved when a women abuses a child -- or if the woman has been sexually abused -- that doesn't absolve her. But it does make clear the harmful influence that heterosexual males can have over females in regard to cooperating in the sexual abuse of a child. And that's important to know. Step-fathers and brothers are the most common sexual abusers of children.

Right wing here is always obsessed with the smallest numbers -- like late term abortions to save the life of a woman -- extremely rare. But the right wing distorts the reality of it and keeps them occupied in discussing it. ONE in every county in the US every year is miniscule. AND IT IS DONE TO SAVE THE LIFE AND/OR HEALTH OF A WOMAN. TO PERMIT HER TO HAVE OTHER CHILDREN.

Same with the number of homosexuals who may be found sexually abusing a child -- or a woman who may be found sexually abusing a child. It's meaningless. Concentrate on the overall numbers and facts - -MALES ARE OUR SEXUAL ABUSERS OF CHILDREN. Homosexuals are 100X LESS likely to sexually abuse a child. Women are generally NOT our sexual abusers of children. So -- who should families be aware of when they consider their children's safety?

Pedophiles seem to be a case of "arrested development" ... as in boys who were turned over to seminaries when they were like 12-14 years old. They're not prepared for the brainwashing they get about human sexually. Emotionally they remain 12-14 years old and will be attracted to other 12-14 year olds even when they've aged and become adults.

Yep ... we do have to consider people like Jimmy Saville raping corpses in British hospitals!!

And, remember Catholic Priest who on visiting a hospital one day raped a young boy lying on his stomach in a CAST which covered most of his torso -- he was in recovery from spinal surgery!

The important thing now is that society is listening to women and children. The less oppression of women, the less sexual abuse of children.

scarlettm512 ago

I'm just trying to point out the obvious. Yes, sometimes homosexuals are actually pedophiles. I would guess that the percentage of homosexuals who molest kids is about the same as the percentage of heterosexuals who molest kids (of course, I'd have to research the numbers to back up that statement -- but that is my guess). Overall, the vast majority of offenders are heterosexual because heterosexuals are the vast majority of the population. Homosexuals are a minority. Therefore, even though the same percentage of that population may be offenders as the heterosexual population, since they make up only a small percentage of the population overall, the raw numbers of homosexual offenders is much, much lower than the raw numbers of heterosexual offenders. Perhaps you should study some statistics to understand the point I am trying to make here.

I'm not trying to blame any group or make connections to pedophilia and homosexuality. You are projecting that on me. You seem to be very devoted to proving that it is ONLY heterosexual males who are sexual predators and I am simply pointing out that ANYONE can be a sexual predator. It may not happen as often, but it does happen. And it is important to recognize this because we don't want a mindset where we think that a child who reports being molested by a woman or a homosexual is not believed because those groups "don't do stuff like that".

I get why the homosexual community is very prickly about this issue because people have wrongly connected pedophilia ONLY to homosexuals (and I don't condone that mindset or excuse it), but it isn't an excuse to pretend that pedophilia can't exist within the homosexual community, too. It is clear that you have your agenda as you keep accusing me of being brainwashed by right-wing articles when I have clearly stated that I am a LIBERAL. I'm not a Fox News watcher. I do actually have many friends (and a nephew) who is gay. I have NO prejudice about homosexuality. I just think it is kind of ridiculous to assert that a man who only molests boys couldn't possibly be considered as having homosexual tendencies as well. The fact that you can't even consider that possibility shows that you aren't open to considering any possibilities that are outside your own political views.

Votescam ago

Scarlet --

Your guesses would be way off -- homosexuals are more than 100X LESS likely to sexually abuse a child than a heterosexual male. That indicates that for every 100 heterosexual abusers, there would be 0 homosexuals abusers.

You should be dedicated to letting parents/families know who the sexual abusers of children are ... IF you don't want to see children sexually abused. It is MALES who are our sexual abusers of children and they are in the majority heterosexual males as "situational" pedophiles.

What I am saying to what studies report .... See below - maybe you haven't see it before?

The Catholic Church/CIA has been trying to label homosexuals as pedophiles for 2,000 years. Remember Anita Bryant --?

Homosexuals have had to overcome 2,000 years of vile homophobic preachings against them by the RCC which taught not only their own members intolerance and hatred for homosexuals, but caused even the parents of homosexuals to HATE their own children and throw them out of their homes. All American society was infected with this hatred for homosexuals.

Hey, a gay nephew! Now that might be a source of information for you ... if not now if he is young, but as begins to mature and moves into a homosexual relationship.

Try this again -- I didn't invent this information ... it's based in studies...

Quote -- ** "Focus on the Facts" -- Sean Cahill, PH.D**

A 1998 Study in the Journal of the American Medical Association found that 90% of pedophiles are men, and 95% of these individuals are heterosexual.

Research has indicated that gay men and lesbians are less likely than heterosexual to sexually abuse children.

Perhaps the most egregious and damaging claim promulgated by anti-gay groups is the claim that homosexuality is intrinsically linked to pedophilia and child sexual abuse. The social science research on sexual orientation and child sexual abuse clearly disproves the claim that homosexuals are more likely to molest children.
A 1998 study in the Journal of the American Medical Association found that 90% of pedophiles are men, and 95% of these individuals are heterosexual. One researcher explained this statistic by noting, "Gay men desire consensual sexual relations with other adult men. Pedophiles are usually adult men who are sexually attracted to pre-pubescent children. They are rarely sexually attracted to other adults. In fact, research has indicated that gay men and lesbians are LESS likely than heterosexuals to sexually abuse children. Two studies that examined the sexual orientation of convicted child molesters found that less than 1% in one study and 0% in the other were lesbian or gay. One psychologist reviewed the existing social science literature on the relationship between sexuality and child sexual abuse and found that "a gay man is no more likely than a straight man to perpetrate sexual activity with children." Further, "cases of perpetration of sexual behavior with a pre-pubescent child by an adult lesbian are virtually nonexistent."

Gay rights activists, like all advocates for children's welfare, oppose child sexual abuse and support equitable age of consent laws that help prevent and punish such abuse. At least 110,000 children are waiting to be adopted in the US. Approximately 588,00 children are currently in foster care. Barring gay men and lesbians from adopting or foster parenting decreases the number of potential suitable homes for children in need. Children who remain in foster care for much of their childhood, as do tens of thousands of American children, are more likely to have emotional problems. Some children in foster care live in 20 or more homes by the time they reach the age of 18. Barring gay men and lesbians from adopting or foster parenting is not simply unjust and unethical; it also decreases the number of potential suitable homes for children in need. Research shows that children raised by gay and lesbian parents are not disadvantaged vis-a-vis their peers raised by heterosexual parents. Footnote 65 -- p.123

A review of 352 medical records of children evaluated for sexual abuse during a 12-month period at a Denver children's hospital found that less than 1% had been abused by a gay man or a lesbian. Of 269 adult perpetrators of child abuse identified among the 352 cases of abuse, only two were gay or lesbian. The vast majority of the children in the study (82%) "were suspected of being abused by a man or a woman who was, or had been, in a heterosexual relationship with a relative of the child." And the review concluded that in this sample, " a child's risk of being molested by his or her relative's heterosexual partner is over 100X greater [than the risk of being molested] by someone who might be identifiable as being homosexual, lesbian, or bisexual."
Jenny, C., and Roesler, T.A. (1994) Are children at risk for sexual abuse by homosexuals? Pediatrics. 94(1).p.44.

In an earlier study of convicted male child molesters in Massachusetts, none of the 175 men were found to have an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation or to be primarily attracted to other adult men. Groth, A.N., and Birnbaum, H.J. (1978).

Adult sexual orientation and attraction to underage persons.
Archives of Sexual Behavior.7(3).pp.175-181. Also : The right-wing "Family Research Council" notes/confirms findings that "almost all child sexual abuse is committed by men.">