To me, one of the crux of this entire thing is the terminology that lays a foundation for the rest of the evidence. As said in this video, the "code words from the FBI" basically dont exist and the codewords were basically created by a /pol/ user during the investigating, except cheese pizza....and for anyone who's not an internet noob and was on 4chan in the early dates know that the term was basically coined by them and other chan sites early on to refer to child porn (users referencing it as cp, other users asking what's cp, then people jokingly saying "cheese pizza" which caught on as a meme of sorts and inside joke)
This would explain why a lot of pizzagate "researchers" are kids in their teens or early twenties, as they werent around 4chan in the early days (when it was actually good).
once you realize cheese pizza is a meme basically created by kids on 4chan, the rest of the evidence starts to fall apart when you realize you have to assume that 50-60 year old politicians who dont understand the internet at all would be using terminology from a niche site that 90% of people on the internet dont even know about or visit.
Especially when, as clearly detailed in the video from that pizzagate researcher who said alephantis threatened his family, it's pretty clear even alephantis doesn't know anything about the internet. (had to ask what a "mod" was)
Am I just way off base here? Are my assumptions correct? I'm not trying to slam pizzagate here, just struggling internally whether there's any legitimacy to it.
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Are_we_sure ago
Yeah, there is no existing food code know to the FBI. That is straight out deception. You can not find any evidence that list of terms existed before the podesta emails were released. In fact, I think it's a straight up deception. It's quite easy to take a dataset and see what words are often used. You often see these word cloud maps of speeches done. I think this happened with the podesta emails.
You know what phrase never appears in the Podesta emails? Cheese pizza. It's not never there, not even once.
It's way higher than 90%. Yeah, this part has always confused me. Hillary is what 70? Podesta is 68. They are active on the Dark Web?
Also why use an existing code? This is a small group of people who know each other. This is not a guy in Florida trying to buy Child Porn from a guy in Iowa over the internet.
If you use known code, it defeats the purpose. Also if code is known outside a group, it becomes slang.
I believe pizzagate started as a complete hoax and used it used existing nonsense conspiracies that people already believed it online. The idea that elite pedophiles control governments predates pizzagate for a very long time. And the people who believe it aren't too strong on facts or rationality or logic. So I believe that the very beginning of pizzagate was started by people who knew that if they put out some clues/starter material. The conspiracy folks would run with it and make all sorts of connections.
Look up at how they faked Hillary Clinton's involvement with Laura Silsby. They make it seem like she knew her. It's completely a hoax. It's quite obvious she had no idea who she was until 10 Baptist Missionaries were arrested in Haiti and the State Department got involved...........like they always do when Americans are arrested overseas.
Conspiracy theories are stories we tell ourselves and we believed them because of cognitive flaws we all have. We take random events and connections and turn them into cause and effect because that's how our brains work.
I can talk more about this later.
chris ago
See, I think there actually IS quite a bit of systematic abuse of children and pedophile rings, but I don't buy into pizzagate. If you watch the documentary on boys town (conspiracy of silence) or look into pedophilia in Hollywood, it's pretty clear it exists AT LEAST in niche and/or local groups. Not sold on the idea that there is a vast network tied into all politicians or that it's part of some underground network of mollock worshippers or whatever, though.
I think it's not rational to dismiss all conspiracy theories, especially now as quite a few have been outed in recent times, but there is definitely a fringe of conspiracy theories that are not based in facts at all.
I try to give pizzagate as much of a chance as I can, though (as evident in this post).
Tanngrisnir ago
Stratfor admitted to using "pizza" as a codeword before. They just never admitted what it was code for.
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1541689 http://pizzagate.wiki/Stratfor https://steemit.com/wikileaks/@rebelskum/pwning-stratfor-the-best-of-wikileaks-global-intelligence-files
chris ago
I'll have to brush up on those stratfor emails, ive read them before...but even so, as outlined in my OP, im not doubting the existinance of CP, cheese pizza or pizza going back to when 4chan created it. Not to mention strator is in the astroturfing business, of course someone there would be saavy enough to know the phrase CP
Tanngrisnir ago
The running theory of how the code "pizza" came about is it was started by military contractors (such as Dyncorp International) in Slavic countries running child rape rings. Pizda was the Slavic word for cunt and colloquially used as a way to say "getting some ass." The people running the ring modified it to the English word "pizza." So it really isn't connected to the 4chan usage of the term at all.
chris ago
I just googled that and it came up only with links to pizzagate information.
Tanngrisnir ago
Anyway, I don't think pizza is a FBI recognized code. It is just a shitty obvious code which has already bitten Stratfor in the ass. Words like cheese and walnut and the like are speculative at best.
The big FBI recognized things are the logos, Besta pizzas in particular is a dead ringer for the boy lover logo. James Alefantis also posted the hashtag "chickenlover" in a picture with a child which is recognized as pedo language. There are more instances but you get the gist.
chris ago
Right, logos: for sure. chickenlover: definitely a phrase, but context matters.
If you look at that instagram post rationally, you can pretty easily infer what happened:
Ive noticed that a lot of pizzagate subscribers tend to not employ or understand occam's razor, in that the simplest explination is usually the correct one. A lot of pizzagate subscribers also dont have kids and dont realize how they act or how people act around them.
Employing both of those in a rational analysis will tell you that my scenario is waaaaaaaaaaaay likelier than some scenario where he's running a secret, underground child sex ring that involves a female worker's child.
Tanngrisnir ago
I get what you mean. I can imagine a logical explanation for everything. I mean can a pizza shop unknowingly have a pedophile logo? Sure, I'm sure they could have hired a separate designer or thought they came up with it independently. How about three on one street? I find that unlikely, although still hypothetically possible. How about three pedo logos on a street which is 90% CIA (the sort of people who should recognize this stuff much more than the average civilian). I think it is really unbelievably astronomically unlikely. After a certain point the most likely thing ends up looking like they know full well what their doing. Same with Alefantis' use of the code words. I can try to give the benefit of the doubt. But the guy flat out had porn (Jeff Koon having sex with his wife) on his Instagram which is connected to the restaurant. You have to either assume that he is just oblivious that kids will see inappropriate stuff on his insta or in his restaurant (which seems unlikely) or accept that he probably doesn't care.
That said, I don't think Comet is anything more than a pedo friendly hangout. I'm sure they are all involved in shadier stuff but I don't think it actually takes place there. The fact that the media is so protective of Alefantis is suspect to me as well. They didn't care about the guy whose store was burnt down because people thought it was the one Mike Brown robbed. They had no tears for the limo driver who had his vehicle wrecked for volunteering to drive Trump even though the limo was essentially his entire livelihood. Hell, the BBC cared more about hypothetic future victims of racism than the women raped in Rotherham. I'm just suspicious of their sudden concern for small businesses.