There should be a special department created for oversight of the CPS. And the oversight committee should have the power to hold the people or employees responsible for allowing such things to happen to be held accountable.
And then do what when kids continue to be raped and beaten severely by their parents? I agree the system is shit and needs something done to it, but there are sick and awful people in the world who become parents.
This is a fallacious argument. You are under mind control. CPS causes more child rape and death, by literally stealing children from their parents and giving them to pedofiles. It is systematic, and by design. I've seen the inner workings firsthand. Wake up, or take your satanic views with you to hell.
Oh please, I worked for CPS for 8 years and while I will be the first to admit there are huge problems with that system, there are also huge problems with many parents who subject their children to severe abuse and neglect! I can't speak for the entire country, but where I live a shit ton more kids are raped and killed living with their parents than in foster care! I'm not saying foster parents haven't done hideous things, but the numbers just don't back up your claim. And before some CPS system hating person jumps on me for working there, just realize that every sector of government or big business has evil people there as well as good guys typically at the bottom levels. Good people are needed within bad systems to help create change from the inside.
Pretending CPS completely responsible for the problems shows ignorance or someone who has a vendetta for some reason. It is "satanic" to sit back and do nothing when any child is being raped or harmed wether that is by the parent or foster care system. What should happen when parents are pimping out their kids for drugs or puncturing internal organs through beatings? Should we just look away and let the parents continue on until the kid dies? Don't be so naïeve and think all parents are treating their children the way God expects them to! And that was big of you to wish hell on me but I'm saved through Jesus Christ so that was a waste of your typing skills!
Dude, I don't work there anymore, and even if I did would you prefer to only have crap social workers who don't value parents rights and will make it even harder for parents to get their kids home? I worked my ass of to get kids returned to their mom or dad because I believe the best place for a child is with their parents if it is in any way possible. Most of my co workers felt the same. We would go to battle with the higher ups to get the kids home and would even go in front of the judge and go against what our agency wanted us to do so that the judge would side with us (social worker and parent) to place the kids back home. Once again there is good and bad in everything and the good ones need to be supported and the bad ones exposed and outed.
Because at the agency I worked at the social workers who removed the kids and handled the initial part of the case would transfer it off to long term workers who were tasked with helping the parents get the kids back home. I did the second job and handled the cases long term.
Seems like a pretty shitty job... I would probably want to kill myself if someone took away my kids. CPS is cruel and unusual punishment 99% of the time. So you think more parents are abusive than aren't who come across CPS? I guess that's where we completely fucking disagree. Yes there are some abusive parents in the world. No, the state does not own us and shouldn't be taking kids away without extreme abuse and lots of evidence. Go after the pedos, go after the really bad parents and don't let them out of jail to have more kids.
It is a shitty job. You see the results of how shitty people are to each other. No actually most of the kids I saw in foster care where I live are there for neglect- specifically drug or alcohol addiction of the parent. Most kids were not abused, but weren't being fed, had no place to live, or were being left to be babysat by people their mom or dad met 5 minutes ago. As you could imagine that is dangerous for a kid and a lot of them are preyed on by pedos .
Drugs do awful things to otherwise good people. And I don't mean weed. I believe what I said before is that more kids were abused and killed by parents than by foster parents. Not that the majority of kids who came to the attention of CPS were abused. I agree completely with you that kids should ONLY be removed as an absolute last resort and that of there is any way possible to keep them with their parents while their parent gets a place to live or goes through drug treatment that's what needs to be done. It's wrong to take them away unless absolutely necessary and it would piss me off to get handed a BS case where the kid could have been kept home but someone made an overzealous call and removed the kid.
One of the saddest parts of all of this is that the parents who have drug problems were typically abused as kids, and mostly sexually abused. They turn to drugs to numb their pain and inadvertently expose their own kids to more pedos.So yes, pedos need to be dealt with severely so they stop ruining lives.
Alcohol addiction is so common - so you think families where one parent is an alcoholic shouldn't have their children?
"I believe what I said before is that more kids were abused and killed by parents than by foster parents."
Ok, I guess we disagree there but you're the "expert."
I'm not here to argue with people. You're perfectly entitled to have you me views. As a group of investigators I thought people here would want some info from someone who has been on the inside of a system that most people know very little about. I absolutely do not agree that if one parent is an alcoholic kids should be removed. The law where I live says the same thing. If there is someone in a household that can keep a kid cared for and safe, that's all the kids need from the CPS standpoint. The other parent can be a massive alcoholic or drug addict, but as long as the kid is taken care of there's no grounds to remove them.
I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with about more kids being killed by natural parent, but all I have said and continue to say is from what I have seen, more kids here have been killed or raped by their parents than by foster parents. That absolutely does not mean foster parents haven't done those things, it just means that the stats show more kids are killed/raped by their parents. What you maybe should be arguing is that based on percentages and more kids living with natural parents, of course there would be more kids killed and raped by natural parents. If you broke it down and looked at the percentage of kids in foster care and how many of them were killed/raped by foster parents then There may be a significant statistical difference that would show a higher likelihood of a kid being killed by a foster parent. I'm not sure if that's the case but I would never say it's not a possibility.
I'm not an "expert" and never portrayed myself that way. You are being very hostile towards someone who is just trying to offer insight on a subject. If this is how we as a community approach everyone who has even been on the inside of what we say we are trying to fight and reform then we are only alienating people and making it harder to reach our goal.
No, I'm just pissed off by CPS, and having seen more than enough cases of CPS being completely wrong and ridiculous and abusive, it is difficult to find the common ground with someone who makes broad statements like more kids are killed by parents than by foster parents. You may have some special knowledge I do not but I have always heard the opposite. I work in the legal field and I know the standards for termination of rights. I got a very bad grade on my research paper in law school when I chose the topic of CPS and why the legal standard is wrong and in my opinion, unconstitutional. People who work in the system, including the judge who was my professor, don't usually like my opinion on CPS. Personally I've been through enough in my own life with the courts and custody and divorce to know what I am talking about which is that it doesn't matter what great parents you are, if someone doesn't like you enough, or if another party has more money, they will take your children from you. CPS is absolutely corrupt and there are a lot of complete bitches who work there. Finding a good CPS worker is a lucky thing. But the entire system is completely wrong. The state doesn't own our kids and shouldn't be able to take them except in severe abuse cases. You said that parents being alcohol and drug addicted constitutes neglect. I know enough lawyers who are alcoholics to believe that if we were to apply that standard to all parents, probably half of the lawyers I know or maybe even 80% of them would not have their children. Personally, I'm a teetotaler and completely against all drugs as well. Yet all it takes is a false allegation and a parent can lose their kids. I am more worried about the children, than the parents. But the parents were given those children for a reason as their protectors and our entire philosophy that the state owns them and can take them at whim until the parents shape up is the huge problem here.
A system that is given such immense power is just ripe for abuse and corruption. They do have way too much power and the only way it seems that they ever get put in check or reformed at all is by being sued. The most effective suits I have heard of were from people who had been in foster care. There was a huge class action case in LA county several years ago that caused massive changes to be made as a result. It is wrong that so many young and poor parents end up being the ones who lose their kids because they don't have the supports and experience needed to navigate such a huge system, so I get what you are saying and why you are pissed. I can see it too and my biggest problem is the "medical neglect" issue. If a parent disagrees with a recommended treatment, they can be considered neglectful. That is bullshit since parents have the right to make medical decisions for their children AND basically every doctor you see will give you different advice! Yet too many times CPS and the courts just blindly side with a doctors recommendation. The unquestioning hero worship of doctors needs to end too!
And on the numbers of child deaths, every state tracks children who die from everything that is not an obvious "natural cause" like cancer or health issue. These cases are reviewed and are overseen by child fatality task forces that report to the state legislature. It is good for average citizens to monitor these boards in their state to watch for trends or anything out of the ordinary. The info is public record and can be found online.
I know the system is screwed and have tried to come up with ways to cause change. I also see the positives and my views may likely be biased by my own experience. I was In foster care. My parents are awful people. I needed help to get away from them because I knew if I didn't I would kill my self or they would kill me. It was that desperate of a situation and no kid should be told by their parents how they were going to be killed and their body disposed of. I went to CPS myself for help and they helped me. I had heard the horror stories but had no where else to turn. I had a great foster mom and social worker, which is what led me to get into that line of work. I had several co workers who had also been in foster care and wanted to help the system from the inside. It's a shit system but not everyone in it is I guess is the overall point I was trying to make.
view the rest of the comments →
YingYangMom ago
There should be a special department created for oversight of the CPS. And the oversight committee should have the power to hold the people or employees responsible for allowing such things to happen to be held accountable.
eyeVoated ago
No. We need to get rid of CPS
IPleadThe2nd ago
And then do what when kids continue to be raped and beaten severely by their parents? I agree the system is shit and needs something done to it, but there are sick and awful people in the world who become parents.
eyeVoated ago
This is a fallacious argument. You are under mind control. CPS causes more child rape and death, by literally stealing children from their parents and giving them to pedofiles. It is systematic, and by design. I've seen the inner workings firsthand. Wake up, or take your satanic views with you to hell.
IPleadThe2nd ago
Oh please, I worked for CPS for 8 years and while I will be the first to admit there are huge problems with that system, there are also huge problems with many parents who subject their children to severe abuse and neglect! I can't speak for the entire country, but where I live a shit ton more kids are raped and killed living with their parents than in foster care! I'm not saying foster parents haven't done hideous things, but the numbers just don't back up your claim. And before some CPS system hating person jumps on me for working there, just realize that every sector of government or big business has evil people there as well as good guys typically at the bottom levels. Good people are needed within bad systems to help create change from the inside.
Pretending CPS completely responsible for the problems shows ignorance or someone who has a vendetta for some reason. It is "satanic" to sit back and do nothing when any child is being raped or harmed wether that is by the parent or foster care system. What should happen when parents are pimping out their kids for drugs or puncturing internal organs through beatings? Should we just look away and let the parents continue on until the kid dies? Don't be so naïeve and think all parents are treating their children the way God expects them to! And that was big of you to wish hell on me but I'm saved through Jesus Christ so that was a waste of your typing skills!
eyeVoated ago
Oh, so you have a vested interest in destroying families with stolen tax dollars. You're fired.
IPleadThe2nd ago
Dude, I don't work there anymore, and even if I did would you prefer to only have crap social workers who don't value parents rights and will make it even harder for parents to get their kids home? I worked my ass of to get kids returned to their mom or dad because I believe the best place for a child is with their parents if it is in any way possible. Most of my co workers felt the same. We would go to battle with the higher ups to get the kids home and would even go in front of the judge and go against what our agency wanted us to do so that the judge would side with us (social worker and parent) to place the kids back home. Once again there is good and bad in everything and the good ones need to be supported and the bad ones exposed and outed.
cakeoflightylight ago
How did the kids get removed if you wanted them with their mothers?
IPleadThe2nd ago
Because at the agency I worked at the social workers who removed the kids and handled the initial part of the case would transfer it off to long term workers who were tasked with helping the parents get the kids back home. I did the second job and handled the cases long term.
cakeoflightylight ago
Seems like a pretty shitty job... I would probably want to kill myself if someone took away my kids. CPS is cruel and unusual punishment 99% of the time. So you think more parents are abusive than aren't who come across CPS? I guess that's where we completely fucking disagree. Yes there are some abusive parents in the world. No, the state does not own us and shouldn't be taking kids away without extreme abuse and lots of evidence. Go after the pedos, go after the really bad parents and don't let them out of jail to have more kids.
IPleadThe2nd ago
It is a shitty job. You see the results of how shitty people are to each other. No actually most of the kids I saw in foster care where I live are there for neglect- specifically drug or alcohol addiction of the parent. Most kids were not abused, but weren't being fed, had no place to live, or were being left to be babysat by people their mom or dad met 5 minutes ago. As you could imagine that is dangerous for a kid and a lot of them are preyed on by pedos .
Drugs do awful things to otherwise good people. And I don't mean weed. I believe what I said before is that more kids were abused and killed by parents than by foster parents. Not that the majority of kids who came to the attention of CPS were abused. I agree completely with you that kids should ONLY be removed as an absolute last resort and that of there is any way possible to keep them with their parents while their parent gets a place to live or goes through drug treatment that's what needs to be done. It's wrong to take them away unless absolutely necessary and it would piss me off to get handed a BS case where the kid could have been kept home but someone made an overzealous call and removed the kid.
One of the saddest parts of all of this is that the parents who have drug problems were typically abused as kids, and mostly sexually abused. They turn to drugs to numb their pain and inadvertently expose their own kids to more pedos.So yes, pedos need to be dealt with severely so they stop ruining lives.
cakeoflightylight ago
Alcohol addiction is so common - so you think families where one parent is an alcoholic shouldn't have their children?
"I believe what I said before is that more kids were abused and killed by parents than by foster parents." Ok, I guess we disagree there but you're the "expert."
IPleadThe2nd ago
I'm not here to argue with people. You're perfectly entitled to have you me views. As a group of investigators I thought people here would want some info from someone who has been on the inside of a system that most people know very little about. I absolutely do not agree that if one parent is an alcoholic kids should be removed. The law where I live says the same thing. If there is someone in a household that can keep a kid cared for and safe, that's all the kids need from the CPS standpoint. The other parent can be a massive alcoholic or drug addict, but as long as the kid is taken care of there's no grounds to remove them.
I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with about more kids being killed by natural parent, but all I have said and continue to say is from what I have seen, more kids here have been killed or raped by their parents than by foster parents. That absolutely does not mean foster parents haven't done those things, it just means that the stats show more kids are killed/raped by their parents. What you maybe should be arguing is that based on percentages and more kids living with natural parents, of course there would be more kids killed and raped by natural parents. If you broke it down and looked at the percentage of kids in foster care and how many of them were killed/raped by foster parents then There may be a significant statistical difference that would show a higher likelihood of a kid being killed by a foster parent. I'm not sure if that's the case but I would never say it's not a possibility.
I'm not an "expert" and never portrayed myself that way. You are being very hostile towards someone who is just trying to offer insight on a subject. If this is how we as a community approach everyone who has even been on the inside of what we say we are trying to fight and reform then we are only alienating people and making it harder to reach our goal.
cakeoflightylight ago
No, I'm just pissed off by CPS, and having seen more than enough cases of CPS being completely wrong and ridiculous and abusive, it is difficult to find the common ground with someone who makes broad statements like more kids are killed by parents than by foster parents. You may have some special knowledge I do not but I have always heard the opposite. I work in the legal field and I know the standards for termination of rights. I got a very bad grade on my research paper in law school when I chose the topic of CPS and why the legal standard is wrong and in my opinion, unconstitutional. People who work in the system, including the judge who was my professor, don't usually like my opinion on CPS. Personally I've been through enough in my own life with the courts and custody and divorce to know what I am talking about which is that it doesn't matter what great parents you are, if someone doesn't like you enough, or if another party has more money, they will take your children from you. CPS is absolutely corrupt and there are a lot of complete bitches who work there. Finding a good CPS worker is a lucky thing. But the entire system is completely wrong. The state doesn't own our kids and shouldn't be able to take them except in severe abuse cases. You said that parents being alcohol and drug addicted constitutes neglect. I know enough lawyers who are alcoholics to believe that if we were to apply that standard to all parents, probably half of the lawyers I know or maybe even 80% of them would not have their children. Personally, I'm a teetotaler and completely against all drugs as well. Yet all it takes is a false allegation and a parent can lose their kids. I am more worried about the children, than the parents. But the parents were given those children for a reason as their protectors and our entire philosophy that the state owns them and can take them at whim until the parents shape up is the huge problem here.
IPleadThe2nd ago
A system that is given such immense power is just ripe for abuse and corruption. They do have way too much power and the only way it seems that they ever get put in check or reformed at all is by being sued. The most effective suits I have heard of were from people who had been in foster care. There was a huge class action case in LA county several years ago that caused massive changes to be made as a result. It is wrong that so many young and poor parents end up being the ones who lose their kids because they don't have the supports and experience needed to navigate such a huge system, so I get what you are saying and why you are pissed. I can see it too and my biggest problem is the "medical neglect" issue. If a parent disagrees with a recommended treatment, they can be considered neglectful. That is bullshit since parents have the right to make medical decisions for their children AND basically every doctor you see will give you different advice! Yet too many times CPS and the courts just blindly side with a doctors recommendation. The unquestioning hero worship of doctors needs to end too!
And on the numbers of child deaths, every state tracks children who die from everything that is not an obvious "natural cause" like cancer or health issue. These cases are reviewed and are overseen by child fatality task forces that report to the state legislature. It is good for average citizens to monitor these boards in their state to watch for trends or anything out of the ordinary. The info is public record and can be found online.
I know the system is screwed and have tried to come up with ways to cause change. I also see the positives and my views may likely be biased by my own experience. I was In foster care. My parents are awful people. I needed help to get away from them because I knew if I didn't I would kill my self or they would kill me. It was that desperate of a situation and no kid should be told by their parents how they were going to be killed and their body disposed of. I went to CPS myself for help and they helped me. I had heard the horror stories but had no where else to turn. I had a great foster mom and social worker, which is what led me to get into that line of work. I had several co workers who had also been in foster care and wanted to help the system from the inside. It's a shit system but not everyone in it is I guess is the overall point I was trying to make.
cakeoflightylight ago
I'm sorry to hear about your childhood. I can understand why you would go into CPS work after what you went through.
IPleadThe2nd ago
I appreciate that. Thank you!