I made a few posts on 4chan with the text below about the SpaceX_NK link.
So, I would like to chime in about this whole "did SpaceX give NK missile tech" thing that seems to be going here. As someone who follows SpaceX and knowing a little bit about NK missile tech I decided to do a little double check research.
Firstly, NK missiles are predominately based on Soviet SCUD designs. This makes sense because the Taepodong-2 missile appears to have been reverse engineered with Chinese/Russian help (or so the speculation) http://missiledefenseadvocacy.org/missile-threat-and-proliferation/todays-missile-threat/north-korea/taepodong-2/ From open source reporting it uses Rodong rocket engines which are scaled up adaptations to the Soviet SS-1.
Most of NK missiles used closed cycle designs with hypergolic for fuel. This allows them be stored and fired on short notice without needing to "fuel" for flight, or at least if they need to fuel they are stable and are no cryogenically contained. From what I can tell they seem to almost all use UDMH and AK27 for fuel and oxidizer respectively.
Now on to SpaceX, most of their technology was designed by ex-NASA people and their main workhorse is the Merlin engine which is a closed cycle gas-generator design (different thank NK closed cycle). They also use cryogenically frozen fuels of RP-1 (jetfuel) and Liquid Oxygen (LOX). This requires constant fueling up until the launch and completely unsuitable for self-defense. Which is why most other offensive missiles use hypergolics or solid rocket fuel (so they can be moved and launched quickly, and low failure rate). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merlin_(rocket_engine_family)
Even SpaceX's future Raptor engine which has prototypes built and have been fired use full-cycle Methane and LOX (even sub chilled even further). Their older designs of the Kestral is a precursor to the Merlin, and the last possible link to NK would be the Draco and Super Draco engines, as they hypergolic fueled engines. The original Draco uses NTO / MMH which is slightly different than the NK missiles, but the main thing is it only has 400N of thrust (which is tiny) and used for maneuvering when docking to the ISS. The Super Dracos do upgrade that significantly to ~71,000N of thrust, but uses the same fuel as the Draco and is pressure fed, rather than closed cycle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raptor_(rocket_engine_family) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kestrel_(rocket_engine) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draco_(rocket_engine_family)
So all literature we have available would say the whole NK/SpaceX angle is not one of SpaceX giving them technology, not only are they required to follow ITAR, as a commercial company they dont want to give it to anyone as it helps them stay ahead in the field. Whatever link NK/SpaceX have, its not direct missile technology. If anything, the Chinese would be more interested in SpaceX technology than NK as it is completely different than anything they have ever built or reverse engineered. However, China would probably be more interested in the landing technology more so than the rocket tech.
The other large thing to note is that none of these SpaceX programs lend well to any type of military application. Most missiles these days use different, reliable, less pre-fueling requirements. Anyone stealing from SpaceX is trying to get into space more so than launching nukes, there is just better tech out there for that purpose.
Ahh, that would make more sense to speculation of SpaceX people in the launch of the Zuma mission (secret government agency and NRO claims to not be them, they normally say when it is and have patches and everything).
It was speculated that the payload for the Zuma mission was for the Navy/Marines, and could have been a weapon or spy satellite specific for searching for landing sites for an invasion.
It was supposed to launch last week but was held either at the request of the customer, or the given reason of "payload fairing". It basically sat on the site ready to launch several days in a row with perfect weather.
It almost makes me think it was a bluff by Trump (to the Chinese/NK) that it was going to do something anti NK and held it back as a bargaining chip. Or they are going to hold off launching it until right before an invasion.
People thought it was related to the Navy/Marines because of some old sea poem with Zuma in it.
So, SpaceX isn't helping NK get off the ground, they use completely different cycles (closed vs open gas generator for Merlin, closed vs full cycle for Raptor, and closed vs pressure fed for Dracos) and different fuels (UDMH/AK27 vs RP/LOX or meth/LOX or NTO/MMH).
Whatever Q wants us to know about SpaceX_NK its not they are building stuff for them (NK missile tech is based off Soviet SS-1 SCUD designs). I would imagine it has something to do with the secret payload of the ZUMA mission SpaceX was going to launch for the government a few weeks ago.
How can we transition to figure out what Q wants us to know about SpaceX_NK instead of memeing something that isn't accurate?
Tetr4gr4mm4ton ago
I was always suspicious about that spaceX/NK claim....good info for all. Thx alot.
idkdu ago
I've been thinking about this post and how it argues that SX isn't in NK because the rocket tech used for payloads in orbit is radically different from ballistic missiles. After yesterday's "ICBM" launch by NK, I had the following thought:
What if NK is being used by SX to do the things it can't really do in the US, or really, anywhere else in the world? What if NK is being used by SX as a ballistic missile R&D and test facility? There's got to be tons of tech transfer between orbital rocketry and missile tech: software, guidance, manufacturing, etc. NK can be used to build and test these weapons in private -- a perfect way for a rogue agency to create its own military grade missile program away from prying eyes and government jurisdiction.
Stukov ago
SpaceX doesn't need to test anything in private, they can test all they want in the US. Furthermore, their technology is so far beyond what NK is doing (seriously look up IAC 2017 BFS/BFR) even beyond what ULA/BO/Airrane are doing. While early testing of space vehicles helped ICBM technology develop, SpaceX and any launch provider is so far beyond what NK is doing, it isn't even really a possibility.
I don't mean to shit on your thoughts, at this point anything we can do to try to figure this out is good, but SpaceX does NRO/AF and other national security launches, there is nothing SpaceX does, that doesn't have the full knowledge (if not support) of the US military and intelligence (anything they tried to to with NK would destroy them because of ITAR). The only thing I considered was if the Chinese stole some stuff from SpaceX, but they would use it for themselves for space program, not missile program in NK (such different paradigms/tech). And the Chinese and Russians already helped NK with their missile program developing their better Scud designs. Additionally NK sells their tech to other countries like Iran (Iran modifies their missiles for lower range to make more of them, as they seem only interested in putting Israel/SA in cross-hairs for main force), so if anyone is using NK as a test bed, its China, Russia, and/or Iran.
Unless of course the CIA has been in charge of NK since Kim Jong Ill died, with Un being a puppet of the deep state. However that's just speculation.
crazycycle ago
Q didn't type NK_SpaceX, it was NK _ SpaceX, so he deliberately added spaces. I don't know what that means, but it seems significant.